BYD just launched the largest car carrier to charge up its global EV ambitions
69 comments
·January 18, 2025senti_sentient
paulryanrogers
Why?
senti_sentient
Not to mention that it doesn’t have the battery degradation that my leaf suffered from. Nissan engineers messed up big time by leaving proper battery thermal management, giving edge to newcomers like BYD.
senti_sentient
Price to build quality/package ratio. For AUD 36ks you can get a BYD Dolphin Premium with blade LFP battery, which will give you around 450 to 500ks of range.Why would you buy a Tesla?
XorNot
Yep. 20 years ago a Prius cost more then that new. Currently my next car will absolutely be a BYD.
andrewinardeer
Tesla's charging infrastrucute is a competitive advantage.
Tesla's software is light years ahead of any other car manufacturer.
Tesla's safety rating is better than BYD.
Just to name three.
sho_hn
Additional context, BYD's factory size: https://x.com/taylorogan/status/1859146242519167249
Discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42228138
Incipient
Vertically integrating. Not as subtle as I'd have expected, but still sensible.
creer
That's pushing vertical integration to extremes. Is there any precedent to car carriers dedicated to one manufacturer? Wikipedia mentions a "Toyota Maru No. 10" which was NOT owned by Toyota - although I don't know if it was dedicated to them.
markrages
> Is there any precedent to car carriers dedicated to one manufacturer?
General Motors helped design the Vert-A-Pac. https://chevyvega.fandom.com/wiki/Vert-A-Pac
creer
Cool engineering, thank you.
sho_hn
https://www.maritimegateway.com/volkswagen-group-orders-lng-...
These are also not owned by VW Logistics, but on long-term lease to them.
Note this is the similar for several BYD RoRo carriers, e.g. the BYD Explorer No.1 and BYD Changzhou are owned by Zodiac Maritime and chartered by/leased to BYD.
As to why a UK-based shipping company owned by a Israeli billionaire based in Monaco buys RoRo carriers from a Chinese shipyard, and then leases them back to a Chinese car maker, I don't know. But I'm also quite curious about the regulatory and financing-related incentives and money flows involved. I'm aware this kind of setup is called a "Non-operating owner" and is fairly common.
creer
Okay fair enough thank you. The article points at just Volkswagen running 9 car carriers just for the north atlantic.
And BYD have been at it for a while, so time for a wholly owned one I guess.
> As to why a UK-based shipping company owned by a Israeli billionaire based in Monaco buys RoRo carriers from a Chinese shipyard, and then leases them back to a Chinese car maker, I don't know.
That's good. No idea if that's the reason, but that would be an easy way to invest in BYD while mostly not being subject to Chinese direct investing legal requirements and problems.
feverzsj
Their workers work 12 hrs a day and only get 2 days off per month. It's the worst kind of modern slavery. I don't think they can produce even qualified cars under such pressure.
defrost
Which factory?
Shenzhen, Changsha, Huizhou, Shanxi, Shanghai (in China), the one in Thailand, in Hungary or Uzbekistan? (etc.)
I ask as Reuters reported the Shenzhen and other plants as having standard eight hour shifts less than two years past: https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/byd-re...
Do you have a source for claim?
feverzsj
Can't you just google a little bit more?
[0] https://www.scmp.com/economy/global-economy/article/3293923/...
[1] https://carnewschina.com/2024/05/20/strike-at-byd-factory-in...
[2] https://clb.org.hk/en/content/auto-workers-bear-brunt-compet...
defrost
> Can't you just google a little bit more?
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
[1] is extremely vague wrt hard details, in summary it's a dispute between Brazilian standard conditions and Chinese standard with hints of "slave like conditions" but nothing concrete.
[2] is about Chinese workers striking to demand longer hours:
According to reports, the main reason for the employees’ discontent was the implementation of a four-shift system and a five-day, eight-hour work schedule. This would result in the loss of overtime pay, leading to a significant reduction in their income.
[3] references workers striking for better pay, safer conditions, et al but doesn't mention slave like conditons etc. that you claimed
hyruo
The number of RORO ships is directly proportional to the volume of automobile exports. As of 2022, China had only 100 such ships, accounting for just 14% of the global fleet. However, considering that Chinese shipbuilding enterprises currently have orders for an additional 200 RORO ships, it is possible that in the future, China's share of the global roll-on/roll-off fleet could reach one-third.
bilsbie
GOOD Point by my wife. Could they double purpose these ships as ferries? Seems like the same basic concept.
wongarsu
It's not well advertised, but you can book voyages on many cargo ships. They just give you one of the crew cabins and pack some more food. Expect to be the only passenger.
There are some issues though. It's slow (slower than an ocean liner since ships are more efficient at low speeds). And it's a cargo vessel, so the cargo sets the schedule. If there's an issue with the cargo that delays the ship by three weeks, you journey is delayed by three weeks. There also just isn't much happening. You have a room, a mess hall, a crew of maybe half a dozen to a dozen people to talk to, a ship to walk around on, and not much else.
It's more of a "the journey is the destination" thing. Accordingly there are a couple youtube channels documenting such journeys
dotancohen
As an astronomy buff, I would do that just to observe the stars from the ocean.
Do you know if they can turn off the bright lights at night? Even for just an hour, coordinated with the crew or captain? I might consider such a journey. I've never seen the southern hemisphere sky.
csomar
Got any links/contacts where you can book this?
jampa
I think there are no climate controls to cool/heat the air to acceptable human levels inside the parking area. I remember seeing on the local news that the inside of the ship looked like a tightly packed parking lot, which seemed to be done by machinery to maximize occupancy.
Here is the only photo I could find: https://movimentoeconomico.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2024/05...
byw
Probably not enough space for people. Often people aren't allowed to stay in their cars.
ggm
I'm just here to say electrek's continuous scroll both delights and annoys me by equal measures (because of my right click new tab habit)
This is a giant RoRo. Compared to the one I used to cross the St Lawrence River a few years back, you could pack hundreds of them inside this in a meta meta car carrier.
dukeofdoom
After the Ticktock ban and surge of Rednote installs, more people are seeing these cars here. And they look amazing for the price. The ban is backfiring spectacularly. And this is just one way.
lolbert7
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rasz
Can it unload "cars" on the beach?
just_steve_h
Ten thousand EV batteries packed into a ship’s hull.
What could go wrong?
fastball
I actually assumed that was part of the impetus for creating their own ship – standard cargo ships probably aren't well-suited to the job and simultaneously are a bit concerned about transporting such cargo.
wongarsu
Specialized car carriers are fairly common. Maybe they added some changes to make this one especially well suited for EVs, like modified fire suppression systems. But it may well be a standard ro-ro ship with an LNG engine.
bilsbie
It would be cool to pull charge off the batteries to power the ship.
jeffbee
I estimate that all those batteries would get that ship at most 20% of the way across the Pacific.
fastball
The ship runs on LNG, which is probably cleaner than charging the cars in China and using that for energy, given China's grid mix.
richardw
It seems to already use some batteries, but not sure for what:
“the new ship includes BYD box-type battery packs and shaft-belt generators for the first time”
dtgriscom
loeg
Salt water spray is not great for vehicles in general, even ignoring batteries. Wonder what the heck they were thinking.
patatero
You could say the same thing about a refined fuel tanker.
thehappypm
Realistically, what is the concern for EV batteries? They already make up a pretty substantial amount of market chair in the US, and yet I don’t hear stories about EV’s being more dangerous or more prone to fires or anything. The only time you ever really see an EV burning is one that was in an accident, and guess what, gas cars also blow up when they’re in an accident sometimes
wongarsu
In terms of fire risk, ten thousand gasoline cars are worse. And they have to be fueled because the cars are driven in and out of the carrier.
EV fires are harder to put out, but in every other way this isn't different from any other car carrier
vachina
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Living in Australia, I chose a BYD over a Tesla. After previously owning a Nissan Leaf, I can clearly see why BYD is leading the EV market.