BYD to offer Tesla-like self-driving tech in all models for free

Its all about milking Americans for more money.

Without all the trade restrictions, you could buy a BYD EV for 10k. It's not the greatest car ever, but it would be a cool city car. Naw, better go and pay 40k for a worse American version.

Temu is getting basically banned. It's not enough I pay around 40% of my income on in taxes and healthcare insurance, I now much pay higher prices for the same stuff on Amazon.

Given their M/O is seemingly using indentured Uighur servants, it probably wouldn’t work economically here.

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/chines...

>At a $14k price point

In China maybe where it's 100k RMB (~roughly $14k). Everywhere else it's the double or at least $25k. It's £26k ($32k) in the UK. It's €32k ($33k) in Germany

Even in Mexico it's $26k (535k pesos) not $14k https://www.autocosmos.com.mx/catalogo/vigente/byd/dolphin

I'll admit I don't quite understand how EV demand works in lower income countries like Mexico. One of the major limits I see in the US is that the main appeal of having an EV is reasonably good (i.e. level 2) charging at home, which isn't an available option for many people in the US who don't have private garages with good electrical service. I feel like this limitation would be even more widespread in a country like Mexico, but maybe that's either incorrect or the appeal of EVs outside of the US doesn't rely quite so much on charging at home.

I was just about to comment that a friend of mine owns a BYD and I got to drive his while in Mexico. Can’t remember the model, but it’s a crossover style.

I was ready to hate on it, but for the price and quality inside at least, wild. It also drove like any other car in the low/mid range that I’ve owned, wheel felt confident and had some heft to it (my preference).

They’re not coming to the US market because there’s a 100% tariff on Chinese EVs. Biden signed that last year.

Is it possible to import them from Mexio to US as a used-car?

US doesn't have a large demand for EVs so I doubt we'll see BYD in the US. They are building a factory in Mexico that is capable of 300,000 vehicles per year.

Subsidies. Basically all savers in China that have money in the bank have to pay for development of what the central Government considers a priority, like steel and aluminium production, solar panels or EV vehicles, or chip manufacturing.

Aluminium and steel costs significantly less in China than the rest of the world, but they now face significant problems because of overcapacity. There are so much factories built and so small demand companies can not survive without help from the Government. They were build thanks to cheap loans from the Government.

So the Government made an investment that is not making money, so basically is a transfer of wealth from bank savers account to industry.

This is also applied in the US and EU, let's remember interest rates below inflation, "Quantitative Easing" and other transfers of wealth the central banks do in the West.

Tesla was also subsidised.

Nissan Leaf now starts at $28k. Chevy Bolt is now $26.5k (was, now discontinued). Given that the dolphin goes for $21k in Mexico, it isn't a huge price diff, definitely not 2-3x. Not sure where you see Model 3 for just $30k, it starts at $40k in the USA. Only in China does a model 3 cost $32k.

Labor costs and a manufacturing industry that isn’t hyperfinancialized by the government

There are tons of used Leafs online for under 8k USD that still have a range of 60-100 miles. Perfect around town car but the price seems to reflect that no one wants one.

It seems like if there was a $15-$20k EV in the US market, it would be a no-brainer "around town" second car.

Every few months Electrek publishes a list of EVs that can be leased in the United States for under $200/month. Sometimes they're as cheap as $99 or even $0/month, depending on your state's incentives.

American companies have been using the excuse of “more technology/screens” to justify the higher price points. Then using vague “inflation”/“pandemic”/“supply chain issues” to justify higher prices.

However as we witnessed during the pandemic, manufacturers of goods tend to increase the cost of the goods despite minimal increase in supply chain, cost of materials or labor. It’s all for maximizing profit and they were “testing” the market to reap massive profits.

With no competition, they (collectively as an industry) felt no need to decrease prices or offer cheaper vehicle options.

I also suspect abuse of CAFE exceptions (ie, “light duty trucks”) is the second leading cause of the death of affordable vehicles.

>You can bet that the 100% tariff on BYD cars in the US isn’t going anywhere with Musk...

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cq55zd2xjreo

>Musk opposes US tariffs on Chinese electric cars. "In fact, I was surprised when they were announced. Things that inhibit freedom of exchange or distort the market are not good," Mr Musk said on Thursday. “Tesla competes quite well in the market in China with no tariffs and no deferential support. I’m in favour of no tariffs," he added.

even if the tariff did disappear, i can't imagine BYD is going to be too eager to get into the US market. there's plenty of other places to sell cars.

I think rest of world will gobble these up though, especially with retaliatory tariffs or straight up import bans on Teslas on the table from aggrieved trading partners.

I'm just waiting for the inevitable fallout that seems to come with most trump advisors to buy BYD stock.

Let's not blame the current administration for tariffs that Biden imposed.

To me, tariffs from the orange man are political theater and appeal to his base, and subsequently sell it via media.

What’s to stop manufacturers of goods from shipping it from a country that is not China, laundering it through a different country. Paper work for container says, “imported from {non tariff restricted country}” at the ship yard.

Cheap Chinese goods still flood the market. Orange man gets to say he has been hard on China via tariff war.

OTOH, theoretically, could we produce a decently priced EV with US materials only? If we go all-in on automation, could one factory worker do the job that many do today, thereby reducing costs? If we can head in that direction, I think Elon wants to compete in that kind of market, not bog it down with regulation.

You don't have to believe in god to call your product "god's eyes" anymore than you have to believe in dragons to use the word "dragon".

If anything, I would consider using the word "god" in a commercial tech product to be disrespectful to an actual believer.

The really nice thing about this is that every single accident that the system gets into will have to be classed as an "Act of God".

The religious are more likely to object to this name. One can imagine a different name in Saudi, for example.

Among atheists one would think it would no more troubling than referencing Legolas in a name. [1]

In China I suspect they'd object to "Mao's Eyes" as a name for this.

[1] Many atheists may register an objection on the grounds of upsetting others in the community.

Mysticism in general is fine, you just can't be a political rival.

Plus, like in English, there are a ton of words people use more for the poetic impressiveness than because they're specifically asserting a supernatural power.

Obviously there are people who don’t believe in god who use that word in phrases to convey a certain sense or meaning.

All religions not approved by the party are frowned upon in China.

Also, when a religion refuses to gain approval, the party quite literally hard forks it. Catholic? No, you have the Chinese Catholic Patriotic Association; which was only recently tentatively reconciled after about 60 years of schism (though it’s still a very uneasy peace).

> I thought religion was frowned upon in Communist China. Am I missing something?

What gave you this idea?

Would you want for all cars to be made in China, the way all computers and smartphones are? I can't imagine any other outcome.

Tesla sells a lot of cars in China (made in China) and exports lots of cars it makes in China to countries like Australia.

So would all the other western automakers. The lower wage- and energy costs in China would strangle them all.

All American car companies would be

It's more the sanctions than the tariffs.

Tesla is fucked.

On 12/17/24 they hit a 52 week high around $490 per share. Since then, in less than two months, they have lost one third of their value. https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/TSLA/

Musk has single-handedly alienated his core domestic buying demographic in favor of a group that, when polled, says they would not consider an EV at rates of around 70%.

EU markets in which TSLA was viable but contested are even worse.

This while Tesla's strongest international competitor is passing on units sold, executing better, and underpricing them.

As someone who has followed Tesla since the Model S, previously held Musk in some regard, and test drove a Model 3 I find this such an abject travesty of an outcome for what should have been a great US based global car maker and someone who had the potential to accomplish such good for the world with their incredible wealth and privilege.