Tesla Is Alienating the People It Needs Most: Study

I had pre-ordered a Model 3 way back (ended up not buying it since they didn't come out with the "cheap version" until years later) and was planning to eventually get a Tesla after my ICE car taps out.

Then it first slowly (never criticizing China or Russia), then quickly (making fun of Ukraine, going full MAGA) and eventually full steam (promoting Germany's anti-democratic far right AfD, the salute) it dawned on me that Elon doesn't give a damn about democracy (he is in fact throwing all his weight behind undermining it across the West).

I care a lot about it, even if it may mean slower progress in some aspects (say compared to China); a system for non-violent regime change is a precious, happy accident of history that's worthwhile defending.

Not buying a Tesla is the least I can do.

Democrats either already own EV's or will buy EV's anyway. The open question is does EV adoption go up among Republicans. I think it will, though I don't know to what extent.

In general, I find surveys or self-reported data to be poor predictors of behavior.

Tesla, as a car company, keeps botching basic car company stuff. Reliability. Parts. Repair. Pricing. New models.

- The Model 3 came out in 2017, which was a while back. The Model S did get a mid-cycle refresh.

- The Cybertruck has been a dud. Sales are way down.[1] Rivian apparently outsells it.

- By now, Tesla's Fake Self Driving isn't fooling anybody, now that people have seen Waymo really doing it.

- Tesla is behind in batteries. They can now make round lithium-ion cells, the previous generation of technology. The current generation is more like BYD's "blade" battery, packaged up in rectangular modules. The next generation is fully solid state batteries, which CATL, BYD, Toyota, and Samsung are spending billions to make work. Tesla does not seem to be active in that area, beyond lab efforts.

- China is getting rather good at making electric cars cheaply. It's not all labor cost. It's partly better design. BYD's "e-axle" is a unit with wheels, axles, differential, and motor. Plugs into a power electronics box and a battery. Plug in a CANbus cable to the controls and go. Simplifies manufacturing.

- Tesla has repeatedly failed to get their costs down. Sales are down. Profits are down.

- The CEO is not devoting full time to the job.

These are all classic car-company mismanagement problems. There are points in GM, Chrysler, and VW history like that.

Tesla likes to pretend they are a special snowflake, but they haven't been that for over a decade.

[1] https://electrek.co/2025/01/02/tesla-cybertruck-sales-are-di...

In short, tesla is not viewed as favorably as other car companies. And in the end, what they offer isn’t much differentiated from competitors that offer similar products.

Still going strong with the Asian tech crowd, from what I see in the Bellevue (Seattle) area. We don’t care about politics (or we actually like Elon), and we don’t have many white friends that shame us about our cars. We just want dependable cars that have minimal maintenance. There aren’t that many of us though and we tend to keep our cars for a very long time.

Surprising to see Toyota rate most favorably here. Unless you count hybrids, Toyota only sells 1 EV (the bZ4X) which has poor range and slow charging.

Just goes to show the power of branding.

For me against Tesla I have:

- I want to POSSESS my car, so I do not want services and remote actions out of my control, Tesla is not the only vendor who try making the car a service, but due to it's track records the sole way to convince me is becoming FLOSS

- I do want V2L/V2H with the best integration with my home p.v. possibly DC-2-DC directly, so far no cars offer something alike even if it's perfectly feasible, but Tesla do not offer even basic V2L...

BYD and Geely are demolishing Tesla on units shipped basis anyway everywhere in the world that Tesla isn't protected by policy. It is a shame because Musk would have owned this space if he had executed.

His atrocious personal behavior distracts from what a terrible and unfocused executive he is. Tesla sales are declining, he failed to deliver on Hyperloop, he failed to deliver on Semis, and he will fail to deliver on FSD just like his myriad promises that he did not deliver on https://qz.com/elon-musks-worst-predictions-promises-1851410...

Downvotes? BYD and Geely each shipped more cars in 2024 than Tesla. Together they more than tripled Tesla's units sold on a much higher growth rate. As an American citizen I consider it a tragedy, but a self-made one.

One way studies in science are 'faked' is by p-hacking. It turns out if you wiggle variables around enough, you can often find statistically significant data that isn't really relevant, but sounds like it could viably be. 538 has an excellent (and highly relevant) p-hacking demo based on real world data. [1] You want to "prove" that this party or that being in power has a statistically significant effect on the economy. It almost certainly doesn't, but if you tweak your sample enough you can "prove" that it does, in a way that sounds completely justifiable.

So this study limited itself exclusively to people intending to buy an EV and within the next year. The fun thing about p-hacking is that it sounds reasonable. For instance on that page limit the data to Democrat presidents, employment, exclude recessions, and you can prove that having a Democrat president is good for the economy. And that data selection even sounds reasonable. But it's not.

Musk not being fond of the political establishment is not exactly breaking news. Yet Tesla continues to dominate EV sales worldwide and domestically to the point that sales figures are broken down into "Tesla" and then "everybody else." And as others have mentioned Toyota dominating in this sample is quite indicative of the fact that they ended up surveying something besides EV favorability.

[1] - https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/p-hacking/

Rivian R2 is going to change the game. It's a direct competitor to the best selling Tesla (Y). I have an R1S (as well as a Y) but R1S is such an amazing SUV to drive. Especially in the bad weather.

How can Toyota even be on this list when they only sell one, terrible, hilariously overpriced electric car, and have stated numerous times they don't want anything to do with EVs?

It's very disappointing. I loved my Prius and would have loved a good Toyota EV. I've even driven their hydrogen car and it's not bad. But they insist on doing a Blockbuster\Nokia\Blackberry\Kodak and we can't stop them.

MAGA thinks EVs after going to blows up in their garage and kill them. That's why Elon did the hail Mary. He guessed EV was going to tank, he did the public heal turn, Tesla will bomb but then he'll get some crazy govt deal for every company.

Here wants to be Boeing/Lockhead/GD, a nationally protected company with fat fat government contracts. Trump might throw him a bone. That's his reward for supporting 2025. The new deep state will happily create a new Howard Hughes.

It's a grift. The grift of the century.