The South Vietnamese pilot who landed a Cessna on a carrier to save his family (2019)
202 comments
·January 26, 2025genedan
refurb
People get so tangled up in the geopolitics of these types of conflicts, and forget that every person the war touched has a personal story.
I’ve known quite a few Vietnamese who lived through the conflict and their stories, no matter how lucky they were, the stories are incredible and hard to comprehend, no matter which side and whether they suffered horribly or made it out real relatively unscathed.
Whether fleeing at a moments notice from your country of birth, never knowing where you are going or whether you’ll ever return. Or even the stories of people seeing the end and planning in advance what they will need and how to make sure family is ok.
Then you think about the scale of it and that tens of millions of humans went through it and it’s impossible to comprehend the scale of it.
What is really remarkable is the resiliency of humans. You speak to people who went through it and realize many have the perspective of “you did what you had to do” and “its a part of my life that is over now”, but try and imagine how hard it must be to live in a country of relative peace and see all these people around you who have never, and will never, go through anything similar, and try and have it all make sense.
It’s also really fascinating talking to people who stayed in South Vietnam after. The entire system is reset. The police, the government, even where you get your food is swept away and rebuilt. I’ve noticed many people thrive on rumors as the government isn’t known for transparency. Days after the war order is restored and you hear rumors of what will come. Neighbors gossip, you do your best to prepare and wait.
arrowsmith
> It’s also really fascinating talking to people who stayed in South Vietnam after. The entire system is reset.
It took me a while to appreciate the significance of renaming Saigon to Ho Chi Minh City. I've lived in HCMC (although I'm not Vietnamese) and the renaming is actually controversial to this day, although most Vietnamese know better than to speak up about it.
Basically, imagine if Russia conquered Ukraine and then renamed Kyiv to "Vladimir Putin City".
refurb
> It took me a while to appreciate the significance of renaming Saigon to Ho Chi Minh City.
The interesting thing is that locals continue to use "Saigon" in everyday conversation. It seems like the government decided that wasn't a fight worth having.
Someone told me that several government agencies still use "Saigon" as well on logos and such.
The interesting thing is that "Saigon" came from the French occupation. The Vietnamese ruling under the French renamed it "Sai Gon", and the French used "Saigon". Before the French arrived, it was called Gai Dinh.
skhr0680
Historically, I think it's akin to when Russia conquered Russia and renamed St. Petersburg to Leningrad
lr1970
> Basically, imagine if Russia conquered Ukraine and then renamed Kyiv to "Vladimir Putin City".
This is really a poor analogy. Kyiv is the birthplace of ancient Russia (Kyiv Rus) and for both Ukrainians and Russians it is like Jerusalem for Jews and Arabs. It is easier to imagine renaming Moscow into Zelensky City than Kyiv into Putin.
sinuhe69
The photo of a man carrying a baby and a woman by his side in the article is not of Buang Ly. The naval institute even has a video of the actual landing here:
https://www.facebook.com/NavalInstitute/videos/1638823169892...
tetris11
Christ. Best I can do:
https://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675069507_evacuation-of...
adamtaylor_13
The guides at the Naval Aviation Museum in Pensacola are incredible at what they do, and they were the first to introduce me to this story.
What’s especially wild is that we actually have footage of this event.
I highly recommend the Naval Aviation Museum if you ever find yourself in Pensacola or nearby!
cushychicken
That’s a bucket list museum destination for me.
They have one of the SBD Dauntless dive bombers at the museum that sunk a Japanese carrier at Midway. Still has holes in it from AA fire if I recall correctly.
adamtaylor_13
You are correct!
Any person who enjoys military/naval history will love this museum. It’s very well maintained and just has some of the coolest stuff in it.
cushychicken
Getting to see a Blue Angels practice for free is just the cherry on top.
dang
Related:
A South Vietnamese Air Force Officer and a Crazy Carrier Landing (2015) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17991021 - Sept 2018 (67 comments)
I vaguely recall that there have been other threads about this too. Can anyone find them?
(Reposts are fine after a year or so; links to past threads are just to satisfy extra-curious readers)
NaOH
Related:
How a Vietnamese helicopter pilot saved his family - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9462885 - April 2015 (15 comments)
dang
Thanks—I think that's the story I was remembering.
If I'm getting this right, these are two different stories involving different pilots and different aircraft but they happened on the same day! (April 29, 1975)
stmw
dang - sorry, OP here, wasn't aware of those - thanks for satisfying the extra-curious
dang
Not at all—reposts of this kind are welcome! The links are just there because some readers enjoy them.
stonesthrowaway
[flagged]
dang
> What does this post have to do with "hacker" news?
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
> critical comments [...] outright silly propaganda comments
I'd need to see specific links to say anything about them.
> while you essential pin this thread on the frontpage
Nobody pinned anything. The thread is ranking on the frontpage because it got plenty of upvotes.
Could you please stop flaming now? You've been doing way too much of that, and not only in this thread.
krustyburger
What a story! Just wild that so many helicopters were destroyed. But everyone on board the ship must have been so gratified that all five children survived.
speed_spread
As the war was ending, a lot of of these choppers wouldn't have been required anymore and would have ended up in some graveyard anyway.
dredmorbius
Fair point, but that hadn't yet been determined and the flight chief and captain were taking a severe career risk (rightly IMO) in making that call.
gedy
If you ever have a chance, talk to Vietnamese immigrants that you work with, and hear their stories of escape. Nearly everyone I've spoken to has a book or movie-worthy tale to tell.
Many went through tough times after the war was over and left years later.
wazoox
That applies equally to most people having been through war and becoming refugees. I know a couple of people who fled from Afghanistan, and that wasn't exactly a cakewalk. Like "my brother was forced to enroll in the talibans and got killed, so they ordered my father to provide another fighter, so he decided to make me escape to Iran instead at age 13, from where I walked / hitchhiked to Sweden in 2 years"
whimsicalism
was the taliban going to follow into all of the EU countries in between Iran and Sweden?
stevenwoo
The Sympathizer/The Committed though fictional have many details that match the stories of different people I know, with the taking off from Saigon airfield while under attack from NVA to others escaping on a boat with only the hope of being picked up by friendlies of some stripe and avoiding pirates or others who could only escape in any case with some of their immediate family and had to get the rest reunited years later. Not a few of the ones old enough to remember the details though are getting scarce simply because of age (some of the people I know were too young to remember anything and had to rely on their parents memories).
technothrasher
I worked with a Vietnamese lady for many years. She refused to ever talk about her escape. She would simply only say, "I was very young. It was bad. I don't like to remember it."
newsclues
My grandmother said the same thing about the end of the Second World War as a young German and wouldn’t elaborate.
csomar
The brain has this nice thing of removing traumatizing memories so that it can move on. Asking people about these things is not a good idea. Just let them recount the tales if they want.
wbl
Yup: many settled in southern coastal states and endured vicious racism aimed at keeping them from shrimping.
louky
I remember seeing women on the sides of the highway in one part of town gathering plants to eat, there's plenty of edible stuff out there, and my parents telling me they were refugees. Must have been in '74/'75 and I was a wee lad. In a Southern state. My parents were PhDs from Berkley and UCLA who got positions in the south so it was a weird time and place. For everyone.
selimthegrim
Many are still here in Louisiana and Texas. But in Louisiana and New Orleans the population is shrinking.
seanmcdirmid
From 2.3% in 2010 to 1.8% in 2020 of Louisiana’s population.
Amezarak
There's no doubt that racism played a role, but a lot of the bitterness was more related to the fact that a huge influx of people, some of them very desperate, arrived and worked in the shrimping industry for low wages and in terrible conditions. This cut the rest of of the labor market off at the knees.
Suddenly a lot of people who had had the job for years, and had maybe been doing it for generations as a family trade, either lost their job or were unable to carry it out profitably.
yieldcrv
the 'luxury' apt building I live in has lots of Ukrainians and Russians (amongst the tech, influencers and onlyfans merchants, the only stateside people that can seemingly afford this location)
the men have really harrowing stories of escaping their respective countries since they weren't allowed to leave, being draftable
and its all very current and ongoing
reaperducer
the 'luxury' apt building I live in has lots of Ukrainians and Russians… the men have really harrowing stories of escaping their respective countries since they weren't allowed to leave, being draftable
My next-door neighbor is one of them.
We were on nodding terms in the hallway for about six months after he moved in, then one day I saw him at the trash chute wearing a "Fuck Putin" shirt, and I asked him about it. He started to tell me his story, and then suddenly stopped, saying he didn't want to talk about it anymore.
Based on the start of the story, I can understand him not wanting to finish it.
s1artibartfast
Were they Russian or Ukrainian? My casual understanding is that the draft is much more significant in Ukraine, although it's hard to find details of it and the penalties for dodgers.
StefanBatory
Russians could leave way easier than Ukrainians, though.
throwaway290
I can confirm friends coming in/out of Russia without much change. All IT workers are exempted from mobilization. People after 30 yo are safe from draft. Yonger are supposed to be draftable but I know someone who is 2x yo and went to visit Russia, fly in and out with no issues. The only difference is airplane tickets more expensive now.
Meanwhile men in Ukraine can be mobilized on the street and good luck leaving the country
yieldcrv
ok
null
fsckboy
[flagged]
stonesthrowaway
[flagged]
gedy
Not sure what your issue is but it's pretty insulting to a lot of people.
esperent
It's a symptom of current US politics, sadly.
I expect it's gonna get worse before it gets better. The best approach, IMO, is to flag, downvote, and move on. Don't engage, don't get in arguments.
I don't mean this in general, just on HN which is not intended to be a political space. For some people, reactionary politics has become their entire world and it's important to show them this doesn't get the reaction they desire here.
stonesthrowaway
[flagged]
bhasi
Great to see a story about the USS Midway. It is currently decommissioned and permanently docked in San Diego as a museum for the public. I've been there - on the very landing strip seen in the photos. Really humbled to have visited such a key part of US history.
Aken
This was really fun to read!
My in-laws are immigrants from Vietnam who left during the war. These stories feel a little closer to home than they would have before meeting them.
dylan604
No simulator to practice on, just the will to protect his wife and family. and I'm assuming a pair of giant steel...
usrusr
Your comment reads a lot like you were assuming that he was a layperson who never flew a plane before. The article looks as of it was deliberately staying ambiguous about that part. But the complete absence of any statement about his previous flight experience or lack thereof suggests that he was a pilot, but they prefer not to talk too much about that part for the sake of a gripping story. (it does say so in the title, even if a reader eager of sensationalism might very well argue "that was the flight that made him a pilot")
Zero experience in carrier operations is super-impressive nonetheless, but it completely pales next to the drama of setting out into nowhere overloaded and with a half-empty fuel tank. The airspeed delta between a Chessna and a carrier steaming into the wind is so low that the landing itself really would not be so that impressive. Impressive bit not crazy impressive.
mannykannot
As the article mentions, the most dangerous aspect of the landing may have been the turbulence and downwash over the fantail. Given that this was a STOL airplane (and also given that the pilot would have had no experience landing on a target moving at almost his stall speed) it might have been safer if the ship just pointed its flight deck into the wind.
I recall from flight school one instructor who liked to demonstrate that the aging Cessna 150 he was often assigned to could be landed in the width of a runway (as performed at an intersection.)
dredmorbius
it might have been safer if the ship just pointed its flight deck into the wind
Reading TFA, that's precisely what occurred:
Chambers ordered his chief engineer to transfer the ship’s electric load to the emergency diesel engines and make steam for 25 knots (29 mph)... The captain turned his ship into the wind to prepare for a fixed-wing landing.... Buang lowered the Bird Dog’s flaps and approached in a shallow descent at a speed of 60 knots (69 mph). With the ship providing an estimated 40 knots (46 mph) of headwind to aid the landing, the light plane slowly caught up.
15 knot headwind plus ship's speed gave 40 kt landing wind, aircraft landed at stall speed of 60 kt airspeed, giving 20 kt to kill on landing. That was a risk on a slick deck, and from the accompanying video the landing was fairly far down the deck, but had sufficient braking distance.
dylan604
> Your comment reads a lot like you were assuming that he was a layperson who never flew a plane before.
You're reading something that's just not there then. I clearly left out the details as TFA clearly states he was a pilot (you just need to have read it and not skimmed). What I was referring to was landing on an airstrip on the ground is drastically different than landing on moving landing strip that also has hidden gotchas for trained pilots. Doing that for the first time as a pilot is one thing. Doing that for the first time with your wife and kids onboard is a whole other level. Your comment, however, is a whole other level going the other direction
whimsicalism
his wife and family would likely have been much safer not on the plane
akdor1154
Reading anything about this war makes me tear up, and I'm not even Vietnamese.
I strongly recommend anyone who travels to Ha Noi to visit Hoa Lo prison - it's an excellent exhibition that shows the horror of both colonialism and war, and i think is made in a genuine good faith effort to promote peace into the future.
danparsonson
I didn't make it there, but the Cu Chi Tunnels near Ho Chi Minh City were also a sobering experience
larusso
I’ve been to the Midway twice and it’s the first time I hear the story. Must have overlooked an exposition or something. I also wonder why they didn’t bring the bird dog over to San Diego? I mean they have the F14 from the USS Enterprise who needed to land on the midway still on the flight deck.
Other than that. What an amazing story. I love the part that the captain didn’t care if he would not only loose his job but also get court marshaled for loss of material.
Simon_O_Rourke
One of the saddest scenes I've witnessed was a march in Paris in 2005 where there were a few hundred south Vietnamese former up marching behind their former flag to a memorial. The thought of everything being lost was quiet strong.
whimsicalism
[flagged]
My dad was one these ARVN soldiers. In the final days of the war he and his drill sergeant stole a helicopter as Saigon fell and flew west, expecting to keep fighting. They wound up in a refugee camp in Thailand and eventually made it to the US. He wouldn't see his family again until Clinton normalized relations with Vietnam 20 years later.
In those final moments, soldiers who knew how to fly took whatever aircraft they could get their hands on, (Chinooks, Hueys, Cessnas, etc.) and flew aimlessly, hoping to run into friendly forces along the way before their fuel ran out.