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MrBeast's Faux Philanthropy

MrBeast's Faux Philanthropy

95 comments

·October 26, 2024

tgsovlerkhgsel

The article seems to be one of the popular "let's shit on a successful person out of envy" articles with little substance behind it.

It primarily raises generic concerns about these kinds of projects, without linking them to these specific projects, after some generic mud-slinging starting with "racist comments made as a teenager" and a very careful wording of "teen grooming allegations" that may leave readers thinking that Donaldson (MrBeast) was accused of grooming a co-host rather than what actually happened (the now-dismissed co-host being accused of grooming).

The well video doesn't mention it but the project site does mention sustainable maintenance of the wells. Of course, this could be either a serious and effective effort or a bit of text on a web site, but the article doesn't try to distinguish that either, it just assumes the worst.

FireBeyond

> The article seems to be one of the popular "let's shit on a successful person out of envy" articles with little substance behind it.

How much substance do you think is here? https://news3lv.com/news/local/las-vegas-staff-say-mrbeast-s...

rowanG077

There is a difference between shitting on someone because of hard facts and shitting on someone because of vague rumors and popular opinion. The article is obviously in the latter category.

hahahacorn

There’s a heuristic in here somewhere regarding philanthropy & first principles.

I respect the authors commitment to showing how MrBeasts philanthropy can be ineffective if not counter productive.

But, in his stated intentions of getting google admoney and redistributing it to people in need, what else is he supposed to do? We can agree to disagree that this itself is a bad premise.

What I’m really interested in is knowing what the Beast Philanthrophy has to say about these things. Are they aware that 6/10 wells are in disrepair in some parts? Are they willing to invisibly commit funds to future maintenance? How does Beast Philanthropy vet orphanages to ensure they’re not the mentioned “farms”?

On the hierarchy of benevolent individuals in this example we have: 1. Rich People Philanthrophy with the intent of helping the less fortunate 2. Journalists stating 1 is inefficient for X, Y, Z, and working with 1 to improve the efficacy of their philanthropy, with the intent of helping the less fortunate 3. Rich People Philanthrophy with the intent of improving their own self image 4. Journalists writing about 1 or 3 with the intent of making them look bad instead of improving outcomes for those in need.

pkphilip

As someone who has worked in community projects in rural areas, I would like to point out a few things:

1. It is not the donor's fault if the wells are not being maintained properly. Ideally this should be something that the locals are paid and trained to do but honestly, if you can't even be bothered to take care of your primary source of water, you have big problems which cannot be solved by ANYONE's philanthropy.

2. That brings me to the point about local attitudes towards donors and what is done for them: I have seen locals really benefit from things donated to them and they then use the new facilities to build a much better future for themselves and their children. HOWEVER, I have also seen locals who absolutely waste whatever is given to them. They may even loot everything down to the last nut and bolt. I have some theories about why this happens (based on personal experience) but I have noticed very different outcomes in different villages for the EXACT SAME help received from donors.

aimazon

If a community isn't prepared, willing or able to maintain a well, is building a well in that community a good example of philanthropy? or is it an example of a lazy one-size fits all solution that reflects poorly on the donor, not the community? The donor is responsible for their choice of donation.

pkphilip

It is a complicated problem. A single village may consist of multiple groups who don't get along with each other. Also, there are people who benefit from the status quo in many ways.

Secondly, there is this issue of trust. There are villages where the people simply do not trust each other AT ALL. I have seen villages where each person thinks they ought to steal first before their neighbours do.

fawley

How much effort does one need to put into evaluating a community compared to building a well? It could be that a 60% failure rate is more efficient than a 0% failure rate with costly evaluations.

(I'm not familiar with Mr. Beast. I will say that the 2 videos I've seen bordered on psychopathy. But I think the general principle of my statement is still worth exploring.)

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aimazon

Many of the philanthropy videos are either manipulated or outright frauds. If you state your aim is to earn a million dollars to spend a million dollars on philanthropy and then after earning the million dollars you spend half a million dollars on philanthropy, the half a million spend is not a great philanthropic gift, it does not justify misappropriating the other half. Philanthropy as a shield is a strategy as old as time. We can forgive people for failing to meet their stated aims if they failed due to naivety following an earnest attempt. Can we forgive people for failing to meet their stated aims wilfully?

The premise of your position is that philanthropy is always a net good, but that isn't true: philanthropy can be harmful. Homelessness is the easiest example to think about, where half-baked philanthropic efforts can have immediate harmful consequences, as we see time and time again.

throwaway48476

There's also a heuristic for people whose smile doesn't reach the eyes.

xbmcuser

Is it really Faux Philanthropy what he is doing is using his platform for promotion of different causes he likes. From what I understand and see none of the things he has done are something unique rather charities and organisations were already doing it he just financed/donated to those organisations and charities. The awareness these organisations and charities received from the video are probably actually worth a lot more than what him doing in his video.

asveikau

If someone listens to him or watches about 30 seconds and doesn't come away with the thought that his charity thing is complete BS, I think that person is probably a very poor judge of character. It's a subjective assessment, and I can't quite put it into words, but he oozes with sliminess and it's quite transparent.

He needs to target an audience of children because they are gullible through inexperience and won't be able to read this from him.

talldayo

> Is it really Faux Philanthropy what he is doing is using his platform for promotion of different causes he likes.

Kinda? There's a thin line between donating food to a homeless shelter and setting up a camera crew to film a vetted contingent of contestants who have to fight in potentially dangerous conditions where Beast Ltd. cannot be held accountable for injuries. One is selfless - the other is petty exploitation. It feels very clear where "the line" is here.

I guess you could argue that Mr. Beast has an incentive to set up these things to maximize profit so he can "donate more to charity" (cough cough buy cars and houses). But at the end of the day the publicity alone is enough to argue that he's exploiting the people involved - the additional ad revenue and inherent high-performance incentive of his work makes it hard to call the whole thing charity. Maybe gambling or, at the most absolute generous, a "game" show.

mikeyouse

That whole line of thought where you can justify immoral acts because you'll donate some of the proceeds is just shitty Effective Altruism with better PR. Really wish we'd stop celebrating that particular line.

evoke4908

No, no, game show is probably right. It's a game show where the contestants are poor and the prize is basic necessities. Staged for the entertainment (and ad revinue) of the less-poor because it makes a number go up slightly in one of the wealthiest companies in history.

xbmcuser

What has his game show or other videos have anything to do about his philanthropy videos.

whoknowsidont

I would highly recommend a book that covers the business and motivations behind a lot of philanthropy: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/539747/winners-take...

MrBeast is unfortunately just one part of this. And he's not even the worst offender sadly.

moralestapia

Can you give a summary of what is it about?

IncreasePosts

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huimang

If you don't know or are unsure about something, you can simply not comment and leave it for someone else.

I don't understand what compels people to go "I don't know, but let me ask the often-wrong-bullshit-generator" and post it as a reply on a forum. The parent commenter could've done that...

neom

From the rich people I know their philanthropy seems to fall into one of two buckets. allaying guilt, or, make more money.

throwaway2413

Not sure how big of a minority we are, but for some of us, philanthropy does actually come from a place of deep gratitude for our community

toomuchtodo

I don’t care about the idea of community, I just want the people I interact with to suffer less. That’s what the money is for.

schiffern

  > allaying guilt
We all know the mere act of being rich makes someone guilty, so that's a tautology.

rowanG077

I think you can make a very convincing argument ALL philanthropy falls into either category. That doesn't it make it bad either. If someone does something that helps other it doesn't really matter in the end why they did it.

notpushkin

Why not both!

neom

honestly... I didn't put or both because I was lazy to think through if "one of three buckets" was the right way to phrase it, and additionally, too lazy to think of another way to phrase it, so yeah, or both. :P

MisterKent

There's another comment referring to Elon. I'll leave that aside, but I think the same analysis can be done for him.

Clearly the population is split on wether or not intent matters when it comes to philanthropy. Some people say, it is only respectable if you're doing it out of the goodness of your heart, not for some ulterior motive (like repairing/boosting your image). On the other side, you could argue that the majority of philanthropy is done for image improvement, and without that benefit millions of people would be left without help. Hoping for "true altruists" to save us is probably never going to work.

True altruists that can gain enough power and resources to make a difference is a paradox. I need 10 billion dollars before meaningful impact happens (random number, but the point stands _a lot of money_). That's more money that any altruistic person would ever get to, since they'd start donating at the 100million or less mark.

The closest we have to a true altruistic person with power is someone like Mackenzie Bezos. No derision here, but she didn't have "what it takes" to get there, but she does have the desire to help. Which is also why we don't hear much about her donations, compared I Mr. Beast, despite her giving orders of magnitude more money away. And more correctly.

Then, we could look one level higher, how do these people acquire their wealth? Clearly selling garbage food to kids, creating fake giveaway videos, and other things isn't exactly helping the world along the way. Making electric cars cool / hip? That's pretty good. Embrace, extend, extinguish? Terrible.

Holistically, Mr. Beast is earning his money off of children and "legal scams". Then, fixing his reputation by donation pennies on the dollar of that back to the world. Overall, probably not a great person. Couple that with how conscious he is of what he's doing based on various leaks, and is say definitely not someone I'd categorize as deserving of any adulation. Obviously not actively evil, but definitely overall harmful to society in his pursuit of fame and wealth.

Aside: how isn't this titled "MrBeast's Faux-lanthropy"?

ibash

The split isn’t on intent. It’s on effectiveness.

In one camp is ineffective philanthropy pretending to be effective. In the other camp is actually effective philanthropy.

What makes is problematic is when the ineffective philanthropist is using the philanthropy to line their own pockets.

atoav

I think the split is different one. It is between people who want to live in a world where they can imagine themselves being the generous philantropist and people who would like to live in a world where philantropists aren't needed because the need for them does not arise.

We have halloween coming up. Imagine one kid taking all the candy first and then acting as a "philantropist" by giving out a fraction of what would pass as a fair share to other kids — oh and he is making videos of it — and he selects who gets something and who doesn't. Very "effective", especially compared to all kids just getting their fair share.

As a parent I'd go with my kid to a psychotherapist if it did that, because it is not normal. Now that is of course an analogy and things are more complex in a capitalist world, but being an arsonist working in the firebrigade doesn't turn you into a hero even when you risk your life to extinguish the fire.

em-bee

that's not what mr.beast is doing. he is taking money from google and advertisers. and yeah, he is not redistributing all of it, pretty much like any other business that donates some of their money for tax reasons. that mr.beast is heavily promoting his philanthropy is simply because it is part of his business model and it earns him more money from ads. he is producing entertainment, no more no less. morally questionable, maybe. but no worse than most entertainment.

thunky

> fair share

Fair share doesn't (or shouldn't) mean even share because that's just not possible.

Everyone has the same opportunity to do what Mr Beast is doing (and many try, some pretty successfully).

tim333

You assume it's ineffective but beyond the actual wells drilled and the like it has a big PR effect to make it look cool, if you make money, to use it help people rather than say the Kardashians making money and using it for huge mansions and plastic surgery for themselves.

I watched the well drilling one and thought it was kinda cool, both for helping and also mucking around with cool drilling machines. (https://youtu.be/mwKJfNYwvm8). I'll admit not taking watching the Kardashians for more than about 30 seconds so I could be wrong there.

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dtagames

Let's not forget that the product itself is demonstrably terrible. The man is purposely aiming to lower the bar as low as possible, producing content strictly for its addictive qualities and appeal to teenagers. His business plan not only produces vast wealth for him and showy but ineffective pseudo-philanthropy (also highly clickbait-y, like the content), it fills the media space and the viewers' attention with garbage.

neom

Do you think also part of it is that to amass that amount of wealth is to extract that much money, I wonder how many "true altruists" would even play that game to begin with?

_factor

How is value created? Every accumulation of wealth is countered by an equal loss of wealth somewhere else. If you’re in a service industry and devise a process that saves $20 per transaction for a customer, then charge $10 for it, you’re making $10 per transaction in efficiency gains. So that compensates and is still altruistic. Not all businesses work this way of course, but there are ways of extracting wealth without leaving the other side worse off.

dragontamer

> Every accumulation of wealth is countered by an equal loss of wealth somewhere else.

This fundamentally contradicts mainline capitalist theory.

People only trade / exchange money when they believe the service (or goods or whatever) is worth the money.

IE: someone pays $20 for X because they believe X is worth $30, $40, or $100 to them. If X were only worth $19, then they would reject the deal and walk away.

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Case in point: if gasoline doubled in price, would you still drive? How high would gasoline prices have to get before you stopped driving?

bsaul

if value couldn't be produced but only change hands, how do you explain the wordlwide growth of GDP over the centuries ?

cryptica

Philanthropy never works. Philanthropy requires large amounts of money. Only the monetary Ponzi yields that kind of money.

So effectively, philanthropy is funded using the proceeds of theft. It's about diffusing harm to all and concentrating the benefits towards a select few.

electriclove

Wow, this guy sure hates Mr Beast. I haven’t seen much but I did see the one where he created 100 wells. The author says these wells will fail soon and do not get repaired or maintained.

I think the reasoning is ridiculous. Shame someone for digging a well because it might not be repaired in the future????

michaelmior

There's also been a number of analyses that suggest he was lying about the number and location of the wells.

M4v3R

There was one video from a disgruntled ex employee, who just noticed that in the video footage some wells are missing/duplicated. That does not prove he didn’t build them. It's only one of the possible reasons. The other possible reason is the footage for these wells might've been damaged or missing so they had to go with what they had.

Now don't get me wrong, some of the stuff he's being accused to has much more merit, for example in one video he showed a dilapidated hospital that he claimed to rebuild from scratch, but other footage revealed that the hospital was in fact in much better condition initially. So he's basically trying to make it look like he's doing more than in reality, and that's definitely something that needs to be called out.

michaelmior

There are many plausible reasons to be sure, but I think in those cases, it would have been much better to do actually explain what happened than effectively lie. (It may have been a lie with no real ill intent, but still a lie.)

alwa

I feel like part of the author’s point was that the well-digging thing is a long and tired example of attention-hungry rich outsiders prancing in to “fix things” and not caring about (or considering) the long-term consequences of their ideas. Even the really good development organizations are constantly learning lessons about unintended second- and third-order consequences: it’s particularly cynical, then, to make a spectacle out of doing the naive thing that seems obvious but that we already know doesn’t really work well.

Doing something pointless with your lavish resources is insulting when, with the same resources and the humility to study what works and ask for good advice, you (or the local population) could instead have done something sustainable. It’s putting your ego and your public profile ahead of the very real material needs whose egregiousness you’re profiting from.

It’s bad enough when it’s nonprofits just making their (sometimes lavish) salaries off the pointlessness. In this case, the man has made a career out of directly turning people’s disability and economic disadvantage and suffering into his primary product that he profits from. His $750-million company got that way entirely by exploiting people’s misery for views and profit. By selling the idea that the problems aren’t all that real, that all it takes is a rich dude with a magic wand and some righteousness. “Fixing” 100 people’s problems and pretending you fixed a society’s worth.

And his little treatise that leaked a few weeks back makes his logic explicit: do the minimum to sound flashy.

> He argues that it is far cheaper and funnier to offer a prize of five packs of Doritos a day instead of $20,000. Then one section asks “What is the goal of our content” before replying “the goal of our content is to excite me”.

At least an evil capitalist WellCorp, Inc. would have to dig wells that keep working after the camera crew leaves, if it wanted to stay in business for very long!

boxed

> Doing something pointless with your lavish resources is insulting when, with the same resources and the humility to study what works and ask for good advice, you (or the local population) could instead have done something sustainable.

That seems like a false dichotomy no? The article is specifically about MrBeast, who would NOT have "lavish resources" if he did what you propose. The stunt nature of the work IS the income stream.

I think it's more reasonable to ask if he's just creating short term gains, or making things worse. I would guess the former. Which is honestly better than the alternative which is he does cruel prank videos with the same budget.

cactus2093

> His $750-million company got that way entirely by exploiting people’s misery for views and profit

Uh, what? The guy runs big elaborate game shows. The contestants are thrilled for the chance to compete to win money. How could you spin that as exploiting people's misery?

kevingadd

Because the competitions are, at least in part, about putting human misery on display for entertainment?

stackghost

It's the same phenomenon as the What Three Words thing. The pitch was that it would solve commerce because in parts of the world they don't have "proper" street addresses.

Or the Three Cups of Tea guy. His foundation had a bunch of schools built in the Himalayas, ostensibly to educate girls, but many of those schools were empty or used to store grain shortly after being built, and less than half of the funds he raised actually went to building "schools".

Just another outsider who thinks they know better.

dyauspitr

How is it faux if he’s giving away a lot of money for pretty objectively good things?

outlore

I remember that video where Mr Beast paid for cataract surgery for a few dozen people and restored their sight. Regardless of intent, that was an immediate and material benefit to many people. It’s fair to question the motives of altruists, especially those who rely on extravagant public shows to pull viewership. But more eyeballs means more ad revenue, which means the altruism experiments can continue. If this is the most efficient, targeted model for altruism, then I’ll take it.

Side note, the Mr Beast handbook is an interesting read https://www.slideshare.net/slideshow/how-to-succeed-at-mrbea...

imaginationra

With that weirdos fake ass forced smile- I imagine in years to come there will be many more articles like this one about this boring androids dark side.

TheRealPomax

Phauxlantropy. Why pass up that opportunity.