Why ghosts wear clothes or white sheets
100 comments
·October 25, 2024wrp
hammock
There are accounts of spirits/ ghosts much earlier than 19th c that aren't "regular" people.
In Homer's Odyssey (8th c. BC), while in the underworld Odysseus attempts to hug his mother Anticlea but is unable to do so.
Thrice I sprang towards her, and my heart bade me clasp her, and thrice she flitted from my arms like a shadow or a dream..... “‘My mother, why dost thou not stay for me, who am eager to clasp thee, that even in the house of Hades we two may cast our arms each about the other.... Is this but a phantom (ghost) that august Persephone has sent me, that I may lament and groan the more?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shade_(mythology)
Ancient Romans used "umbrae" (shadows) to refer to ghostly spirits, which for me invokes the figures on the wall of Plato's cave
bbarnett
I'm always leery of translations like this, as they are often translated with the world view of the day.
Interesting regardless though.
pastage
The latest translation was made just a few years ago. [1] I wish someone could track down all translations of it and post it somewhere, so one could try do compare different passages through time, the Italian Wikipedia has a good list of international translations.
One should not that Homers dialect is arcane from the start of the Greek golden age, so translation is always going to be interesting.
https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traduzioni_dell%27Odissea
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_translations_of_Homer
conception
And in the 19th century with the advent of cameras and their “ghosting” of images with people moving.
See also the rise of https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantasmagoria in the 19th.
woleium
I read that they fade over time. A famous one was a lady in red who appeared in a castle in the UK. Over a couple hundred years of sightings the color if her dress faded from deep red through crimson then pink then finally white.
wrp
Well, yes, I suppose repeated washings over a few centuries would do that.
wruza
Probably dried it on the sun too much.
canadianfella
[dead]
adzm
Homer describes them as a vapor or smoke I believe
throwaway19972
Roman writers used "umbra" or "shadow"/"shade" as a word for specters, phantoms, ghosts, etc. They had many other words, too, but this is probably closest to how dead apparitions were physically perceived.
derbOac
I remember some tradition that Roman ghosts were often associated with or seen as blue for some reason? That's only my fuzzy and likely incorrect memory though, from when I was studying in college. I have a memory of a play or piece of literature where a candle flame turns blue and it was meant as a cue to what was about to happen.
edflsafoiewq
The Witch of Endor described Samuel as a "god" coming up out of the earth in the appearance of an old man in a robe.
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tiahura
skia - shade / shadow
robofanatic
for me horror movies with ghosts shown as regular people in foggy daylight (for example the kid in the original Omen) are scarier then the ones that fly at night or have heavy makeups with abnormal bodies etc.
anotherhue
> HORATIO A countenance more in sorrow than in anger.
> HAMLET Pale or red?
> HORATIO Nay, very pale.
~1600
sparin9
Thanks, that was enlightening.
Izkata
There's another theory I've heard that goes more into what ghosts are, that isn't in the article: They're not spirits, but more like an imprint on reality. This would also explain why so many just repeat the same actions over and over, and to some extent not just clothes but other things that appear in a ghost-like form they'd interact with. The one missing part of this theory is, it should be possible to create such an imprint with someone who is still alive.
ZeroGravitas
whbrown
really makes you wonder what Babbage was trying to achieve with his Difference Machine...
derbOac
> The one missing part of this theory is, it should be possible to create such an imprint with someone who is still alive.
I've read of this idea, it's traditional in some cultures, I just don't remember the name of it. I think it's cognate with ideas of doppelgangers and so forth.
I also think there's often an implicit assumption that whatever it is that causes the "imprint" can only reach a certain necessary magnitude that is commensurate with death or dying.
I feel obliged to note this is not my own perspective on things at all, although I admit I like reading about and thinking about these things sometimes as a kind of psychosocial phenomenon, and think it's worthwhile to engage in metaphysical discussions sometimes just as a kind of check.
mrob
In Japanese folklore there's the concept of "ikiryō" (literally "living ghost"):
margalabargala
The second missing part of the theory, is the lack of existence of its subjects.
It's not a theory, just detailed, more self-consistent fiction. Like Tolkien's very detailed descriptions of elves.
musicale
If it is consistent with a set of axioms, then it is a theory.
margalabargala
Consistency with a set of axioms is necessary but not sufficient for a theory.
From Wikipedia: In modern science, the term "theory" refers to scientific theories, a well-confirmed type of explanation of nature, made in a way consistent with the scientific method, and fulfilling the criteria required by modern science.
onionisafruit
That’s a great comparison with Tolkien. It’s fun to theorize about nonsense.
null
exodust
The theory ties in with "Morphic resonance", the cool-sounding name of an attempt to rationalise imprints and collective memories among other things.
I don't see the harm in pondering such theories. After all, the fact we're here and living in the universe at all, means there's a whole bunch of things happening behind the scenes we have no idea about. Perhaps one day, "ghost imprints" will be something science can measure. Or other pseudo-science like telepathy or premonitions, may move into actual science with as yet unknown discoveries. I'm not saying will, but they may.
4dregress
You would think there would be all sorts of ghosts then, from all forms of life on earth.
canadianfella
[dead]
cesarb
If ghosts are the souls of deceased people, unless they were nudists, wouldn't they prefer to wear clothes similar to the ones they used when they were alive?
That is, instead of "ghost-seers dress the ghost", it's the ghost that dresses itself. In fact, that whole paragraph even makes sense once flipped that way:
"[...] ghosts dress themselves, automatically, through unconscious processes. And so we see a ghost in its usual dress because that is the mental picture the ghost has of itself, and this choice of garment is most likely to inspire recognition."
cheschire
"Is it really so hard to believe? Your clothes are different, the plugs in your arms and head are gone, your hair has changed. Your appearance now is what we call 'residual self-image'. It is the mental projection of your digital self."
mionhe
Lovely to run across a Matrix quote when you were expecting something else. Bravo.
null
anotherhue
Easier to do optical illusions / alpha blends with white clothes too, so I suspect that tech furtherd the practice.
sfink
Why is the question about clothes? Why not ask why ghosts usually appear wearing skin? Or flesh? I guess these days in common depictions, clothes > skeleton > peeled > nude in terms of frequency. And what about age, or state of injury? It seems more commonly reported that ghosts do not exhibit their fatal injuries, though again it "happens". Or the big question: why should anything be visible at all?
If a ghost is meant to be associated with a spirit or soul, there's no particular reason for them to have any form or be visible at all. But as an exercise in worldbuilding, they can be, and their visual appearance can give all kinds of fascinating clues about their previous existence or the viewers'. I'd rather speculate about that.
neom
When I lived in manhattan I was friends with this hippie spiritual Buddhist woman who was very into reincarnation, she described it as a "glitch in past life memory system". Basically something from the history line accidentally implanted a memory in the current that manifested as the person witnessing a past life component. I always thought that was pretty fun.
GistNoesis
The ghost phenomenon is all about information.
When a system has a lot of complexity, it needs a lot of computational resources to be simulated accurately.
When suddenly this complexity is not needed anymore, because the system got "simplified" suddenly. The pockets of available computation diffuse slowly into the environment.
The analog for the scientific person here is like your adaptive grid in the simulation was locally in high resolution because it was needed by the physical process, and suddenly the physical process doesn't need it anymore but the simulation grid stays in high resolution.
When some other high complexity process comes nearby (like another rich soul), it benefits from this increased resolution which usually allows him unconsciously to run his computational wetware in higher gear, like in a form of mildly induced schizophrenia, vivid dreams, or hallucinations.
Brains as general information analyzing devices can perceive the shape of this echo from the past, decoding from the faint ripples the stone that impacted the water.
The mythology of absorbing the essence from the passed is varied across time and places, ranging from soul capturing gems, the fighting to survive against the erosion of time like in Highlander accumulating the energy of your rivals by eating their brain.
Looking at it only as a physical process ("real") will make you miss it. It has to be seen through the lens of the ethereal plane. Information is conserved, but details can be compressed more or less. Degrees of freedom accumulated or used are different things.
JohnFen
I always thought the "white sheet" thing was just about representing funeral wrapping. I found it interesting that the topic goes much deeper than that.
soco
Who does funeral wrapping? I mean, which cultures currently do, or did recently (in the time of ghosts)?
quietbritishjim
I thought the point of the white sheet trope was that the ghost (whether clothed or not) is invisible, and so they throw a real physical sheet over themselves so they can be seen at all. Although, a ghost that's visible but naked would be just as good justification.
Ekaros
Might dust coverings be also part of this? Not that those are used here, but them being used in some abandoned or less frequented locations with slight movements of air could explain some imaginery. Peeking from windows for example and seeing objects covered in sheets.
masswerk
That's also my theory: Country houses used to be partially shut down, a whole wing, which may only be required as an accommodation for guests, or the household may contract to a manageable core of room in winter. Every now and then, something from these shutdown rooms would be required and somebody would be sent out into this eerie realm of dust covers. A faint rustle in the dark, there, and again (a disturbed mouse), breaking the silence of these deserted (and supposedly quiet) rooms, could make this quite the challenge for the faint hearted. And what ultimate of psychological horrors could be lurking in the dark, other than these covers coming to life?
However, there's another theory about this (not mine, sadly): "The most common ghosts are the ones that appear dressed in a white sheet with flailing arms. These are people who died while changing their duvet covers and they are condemned to wander in bedrooms forever, trying to find the corners." ;-)
swayvil
My small experience with seeing a ghost was that it appeared out of a mist. The white sheet could be a figurative way of portraying that. But there was a face too, and that stood out most starkly. And the gaze, when it fell on me, was electrically frightening.
russfink
I was probably 2 years old and was fussing loudly in the middle of the night, when a kind lady came through a door and walked over to me and hushed me down. She was in a blue ball gown-like dress. The next morning, I remember looking at the part of the room where she came out of, and there was no door there. Years later, my sibs told me that house was haunted af. I’ve spent my life trying to rationalize this experience.
LaMarseillaise
I have vivid nighttime hallucinations. Sometimes it is bugs or spiders (so many spiders), other times dancing teacups emptying themselves onto my face. I remember a time when my alarm clock was a lion that I had to tame. But a few times it was very much what you describe. In one case, a ghostly looking woman looked me directly in the face from not more than an inch away.
Our minds get kind of funny when we are asleep. They manifest strange and incomprehensible imagery. I wouldn’t make too much of it.
(By the way, I have these much more frequently when I am stressed. Perhaps that was a factor for you?)
swayvil
You are "explaining" it. The consensual narrative has sprung a leak and you are striving to patch it.
evanjrowley
Ghost sightings can cover a wide range of clothes and that is generally because ghosts wear whatever they wore when their mortal form died. The concept of ghosts dressed in white gained prevalence at a time and place when white linens were rapidly becoming common for the average person. The industrial revolution increased the supply of white linen clothes, also white linen bedding, both at homes and in hospitals. Ghost stories gained popularity during this era, which was also a time of growing world population and growing deaths in densely populated areas. This intersection is why ghostly appearances very much fit the description of a nightgown-wearing tuberculosis patient. During the Victorian-era in Great Britain, the medical field was advancing rapidly, so a keener awareness of life and death coincided with customary dress/fashion of the time to produce stereotypical images of ghosts and ghouls.
slavboj
The white sheet alludes to a burial shroud.
I've only read lightly on the historical literature of ghosts, but I think TFA has some basic misconceptions. Through most of history, ghost sightings appeared to be of regular people, with the witness only realizing later that it was a ghost. The conception of ghosts having ethereal appearance appears to have become widespread in the late 19th century.