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My car charger can boil water really fast [video]

throw0101c

He mentions induction 'hot plates' towards the end, and says that they're limited to the same 1800W and 120V as kettles, but there are "commercial" portable induction stoves that are 220V and can go up to 3500 and 5000W; e.g.:

* https://www.vevor.ca/induction-cooktop-c_10592/vevor-portabl...

* https://www.trueinduction.com/Commercial-Single-Induction-Co...

Just need a NEMA 6 plug (GFCI/AFCI per code as well probably):

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NEMA_connector#Nomenclature

maccard

In the US. In the UK 2200W induction plates are readily available with a standard plug for ~£40, or if you spend a little more you can go to 3kW - [0] which is about the limit of most domestic circuits but is hotter than most gas hobs.

If you _really_ want more than that you can go a little mental and use one with an integrated battery which can push out 10 kW [1]

[0] https://www.nisbets.co.uk/nisbets-essentials-single-zone-ind...

[1] https://www.impulselabs.com/

jchw

This begs the question, and I've genuinely thought this before, of why we don't just strap a battery to a kettle and end this silly debate. If it takes 5 minutes to boil a cup of water in a 1000 watt kettle, that's somewhere around 80Wh... I guess it would be kind of expensive, but couldn't you make a pretty fast kettle with some number of high discharge battery cells?

(Well honestly, I guess the real answer is outside of Internet debates most people probably just don't consider 5 minutes to boil a cup of water to be a problem.)

Nextgrid

It would turn an inert device that costs a couple bucks to manufacture and has affectively no usage limit into a bomb that costs a couple hundred bucks (due to lack of economy of scale) and is limited by the battery's rated number of cycles. The battery's proximity to the heat source wouldn't help.

kondro

People that care about the time it takes to boil water just have an instant hot water boiler on (or under) their bench.

drooby

Impulse Labs is doing exactly this..

I believe there master plan foresees a future where batteries are more integrated with a house for decentralized grid storage. But the additional consumer advantage is better hardware - i.e cooking time.

maccard

That seems a terrible waste of batteries to me. A boiling water tap seems like a better idea to me - electric heater with a pressurised insulated vessel that just dispenses from your tap.

martythemaniak

It's probably just the price of batteries. You can definitely do this and you'd need like 8 18650 batteries, which today you can get on amazon for $30 USD. A decade ago it might have cost $200-$300.

Given that premium kettles already sell for about $100, there's definitely room for an ultra premium kettle that boils water laughably fast for $150.

crote

Sure, but over in 230V-land 3500W hot plates are completely standard, and can plug into any regular wall socket. Same with microwaves and hot-air ovens: just put it anywhere on your kitchen countertop and plug it into the nearest socket.

We do also have a "kitchen plug" for high-powered appliances. Those go up to 7.3kW in their regular dual-single-phase 16A version, 11kW when wired with three phases (quite common in households these days), or even 17kW with the (understandably) rarely-used 25A plug variant with three-phase wiring.

And that's not even commercial equipment, just what you'd pick up at your local Best Buy equivalent. The commercial stuff uses CeeForm, which is a three-phase 16A/32A/63A/125A plug. Or it's getting hard-wired.

emchammer

What is the specific standard for domestic 16 A and 25 A 3-phase plugs you’re referring to?

maccard

Not OP but - I can't answer the specific regs, but 16A/240V is absolutely bog standard for the UK and every high street store stocks ovens that will draw this down. They need to be on their own circuit, e.g. this [0].

I've never seen a single oven pull more than this, but devices like [1] are fairly common where you have two independent ovens in one, and it can pull 21A - this would necessitate the 25A supply.

As for three phase - https://www.howdens.com/-/media/howdens/assets/clh_asset_pro... this hob (which I have) will take 3-phase 16A, or single phase 32A. I've not come across any 32A 3-phase devices for home usage, though.

[0] https://ao.com/product/b54cr71g0b-neff-n70-slide--hide-elect...

[1] https://www.smeguk.com/products/DUSF6300X

Mistletoe

I swear Vevor makes everything.

silexia

I am a farmer with giant water pumps and center pivots that run on 3 phase 480 volt power. One of my pumps has 85 horsepower. I wonder if I could wire up some sort of custom made tea kettle and get water to boil in five seconds?

wcoenen

For a small amount of water, I would be afraid of flashing the water into steam, and the resulting steam explosion.

mesrik

Well, that's about what happens in Sauna with electric stove.

In Finland we do it every day and have done decades already.

Those who may not know electric stoves have been about fifty years common use at least in urban environments. Stoves have anything from three, one in each of three phase current used heating elements (resistor coils) 400V 6-8 kW power draw commonly in small house stoves and 2-3 times that swimming baths saunas stoves.

While sitting topmost sauna benches bathing, we throw fresh water from bucket with a sauna laddle (saunakauha) water to stove(s) anything from small drippings to a pint with trying to little spread it out. This is to get steam and make it pleasant relaxing 'löyly' as we call it.

The stove is usually heated about an hour or so before starting bathing to get temperature somewhere 70°-100°C (158-212°F).

It's not advisable to have stove showing those red hot glowing elements peeking out behind stones, but it does happen if stones were not laid properly. But even if water gets directly to elements those will not break or get any damage as they are made intentionally to resist that.

So boiling water practically immediately does happen, it's not particularly dangerous when applied in circumstances where equipment is made to withstand that is nothing miraculous. And that really happens millions of times each day in Finland and some other places where that kind of sauna culture is practised both at people private homes and also public swimming baths saunas alike.

I will be observing it next time about in 14 hours from this writing as I'm going swimming as usual tomorrow morning at 6:00 am. when pool opens early tomorrow, and then likewise twice more (Wed, Fri). Also once more (Thu) evening sauna reservation slot i've got this flat I live.

There is a quite good english page about Finish sauna in Wikipedia, but to get a glimpse what modern sauna and stoves look Harvia a long time stove manufacturer web pages you get some sense what I'm writing about.

- https://www.harvia.com/en/

buildbot

It’s a good point but there might be a pretty big difference in force because the ladled pint of water is not contained on any axis. A pint of water in a cup, with up as the only exit, subjected to the full current of a 3 phase 480v circuit is probably going to generate a good size jet of steam straight up.

oniony

And that's why nobody invites you to parties.

bot403

Because he keeps flash boiling steam at the party and burning the guests?

ahartmetz

There is something like that in the original video - running a 120 V kettle at 240 V makes it boil four times as fast. But only a few times.

4gotunameagain

For sure, you could use six 240V heating elements wired in series in three pairs to get their rated power.

Of you can wire 240V elements directly to 480V to quadruple the power, as shown in the video ;)

namibj

3-phase electeode Boiler comes to mind. Just have it as a pass-through with a grounded shield at the end to keep you from accidentally touching dangerous voltage.

Nextgrid

Wouldn't that cause electrolysis and make the water unsafe to drink?

malfist

What do you imagine happens to water when it undergoes electrolysis?

skylurk

You might need a pressure vessel and a stirrer to hit 100 deg C in 5 seconds.

gcanyon

I would love to see that.

quickthrowman

You could run (10) of these 9kW 480V three-phase immersion heaters [0] in place of your 85 HP motor, assuming ~110A FLA @ 480V = 91.5kW. The 9kW immersion heaters are 10.8A each at 480V three-phase (would be 75A if it was 120V single-phase!)

Just make sure you have somewhere for the steam to go, it takes up a bit more room than water ;)

Is your three-phase a corner-grounded delta service? I’ve never seen one in the wild but I hear they’re used for three-phase ag service drops that are strictly used to run motors. A and C are tapped normally on the secondary but the B phase is bonded to ground and also a line conductor, conductor color is white for B phase instead of orange.

[0] https://iseinc.com/_shop/480v-3ph-9kw-immersion-heater-47-14...

lxgr

Great video, but coincidentally two weeks too late for me:

I never knew about the boil auto-shut-off mechanism and the overheat/"boil-dry" protection circuit being two different things in some kettles. In those, pouring out the entire water before the auto-off had a chance to kick in can cause a situation where the kettle stays on (due to not enough steam being present to trip it), but the boil-dry protection circuit continuously engages and disengages until somebody notices or the thing self-destroys – ours did the latter.

Now we have one with a switch at the bottom, and I'm hoping that due to that construction, the boil-dry protection will also disengage the switch if needed. (It also helps that the switch automatically disengages when lifting the kettle off its base.)

spike021

I have an electric water boiler like that also. I have to be very mindful to press a button to turn it off if i return it empty to the induction plate/holder otherwise it starts clicking and beeping and freaking out.

CarVac

I have a kettle with 5°-settable temperature targets that has transformed my tea drinking.

It also has a function to hold temperature for up to 30 minutes, and because it has actual logic going on inside, when you lift it off the base it knows this and won't turn back on when you put it back.

throwaway198846

> the boil-dry protection circuit continuously engages and disengages until somebody notices or the thing self-destroys – ours did the latter.

It is always fascinating to see unforeseen failure modes created by automation.

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JojoFatsani

You can run an induction range top off a nema 14-50 and be boiling in like a minute

andrybak

A 2022 Technology Connections video explores various ways to boil water: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_yMMTVVJI4c

And a 2020 video about different voltages in the US electrical systems: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMmUoZh3Hq4

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JonChesterfield

I'm sure there was a period where one couldn't find a 3kW kettle in the UK on power efficiency grounds, one was supposed to run a 2kW one instead to save the planet. But now when I search I find 3kW models again. So either that was a nightmare of some sort or sanity has prevailed.

Chatgpt thinks this was threatened in 2010 then postponed in 2016 then cancelled, which vaguely aligns with my timeline of interest in tea.

crote

I highly doubt that. Electric kettles are just about 100% efficient, and the only difference between a 3kW kettle and a 2kW one is how long it'll take to boil. The total energy consumed will be more-or-less the same.

Are you perhaps conflating it with the EU regulations on vacuum cleaners going in around 2017? As with all EU regulations, this of course resulted in a decent bunch of EU-bashing in UK media by the usual suspects - despite less-power-hungry vacuum cleaners being just as effective as the more power-hungry ones, and power consumption being inflated by manufacturers to market their vacuums, as plenty of people believed that "bigger number = more suck = more better".

poizan42

But the more powerful kettle should be slightly more efficient[0] because there is less time for heat to escape from the kettle while the water is being heated.

[0] Energy efficiency at boiling the water. A kettle is always 100% effective at making heat.

throwaway198846

You could use vacuum like in a vacuum flask. In fact to my surprise the product seems to already exists although its selling point is how long it holds water hot after boiling and not its efficiency.

fsh

There was no such thing in the UK. ChatGPT is trained to produce text that fulfills the user's expectations. If you put a prejudiced prompt in, expect a corresponding result.

jrmg

People are downvoting you because your story seems crazy, but you’re right (and wrong).

In the early 2010s there were reports that the EU was set to ban 3kW kettles in the anti-EU tabloid press.

The ‘plans’ were discussions, were general (about ‘high energy appliances’, not specifically kettles), and never got beyond the initial discussion stage - according to the same press because of fears they would drive Britons to vote for Brexit, although I’m not sure I believe that. As other commenters say, unlike other appliances that could be made more efficient, kettles are almost 100% efficient already, so the power draw doesn’t really matter. I still have some faith the authorities looking into home appliance energy efficiency would know that.

https://hoaxes.org/weblog/comments/eu_not_banning_kettles

https://www.the-independent.com/news/uk/politics/eu-pauses-p...

jnsaff2

UK power grid has the Eastenders effect. Where the ending credits of the Eastenders soap signals a large increase in power draw from the grid as people will put on the tea kettle at the end of the show. The grid operators have to dispatch enough power to cover for this.

While the amount of energy used to boil water at 2kW is not significantly different from 3kW (2kW has a tiny amount of more atmospheric losses I think), there is a difference for the impact on the grid. Same energy but more power generating and transmission line capacity needed.

holdit

Here's a video showing an engineer at the national grid bringing hydro-electric plants online at the closing credits of a popular soap opera in anticipation of the millions of kettle that are about to be switched on!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slDAvewWfrA

quickthrowman

A larger heating element is very slightly more efficient due to less heat escaping as the liquid is heated more quickly. Resistive electric heating is always 100% efficient no matter the size of the heating element.

Keep in mind that heat is constantly being transferred between things that are different temperatures, the faster something reaches the set point temperature, the less time there is to lose heat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_equation

maccard

If we really cared about efficiency of these devices, they'd be insulated.