Stop 'reactions' to email by adding a postfix header (2024)
70 comments
·November 2, 2025nephanth
kjs3
It's a embrace-extend-extiguish play like the old days. Add a 'feature' that doesn't technically break the rules (or only does a little), get your users used to it (by making it the default, opt-out, etc) and hope that your users will pressure people not using your product to move. "What do you mean you didn't see my email reaction? That's the best feature in the whole world. You should really switch to outlook, etc.". See: every M$-only feature in IE.
dpark
How is this argument not just “no one should ever implement new features”?
I don’t really care for the Outlook reactions and find them out of place, but this implementation doesn’t break anyone else. It’s also exactly how Apple implemented reactions being sent to SMS recipients.
Disclosure: I work at Microsoft.
kjs3
Yes, we got the "you're just a luddite that hates progress" sophistry from you guys in the IE days (and before). "We're doing the same thing as Apple" isn't a particularly persuasive counter. I always appreciated Balmer in that that he didn't waste time bullshitting anyone that he was trying to create walled gardens for M$ products by cooping standards.
Hizonner
This feels like something that should not exist, period. For any email important enough to actually send, asking people to guess what a single-emoji "reaction" actually means is a recipe for bad communication.
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whatevaa
Even in outlook those reactions look out of place.
snowwrestler
We use MS365 at work and colleagues “react” in Outlook with thumbs-up to my emails sometimes. Fine, I guess it is a lightweight way to signal support or agreement. Not too different from reactions in Teams or Slack.
BUT… there is a keyboard shortcut to do it, apparently, that is not too far from my typical typing pattern. Because sometimes I end up sending a thumbs-up reaction email when I did not mean to.
This is incredibly awkward when it goes to some random external partner or vendor. And especially when I’m in the process of drafting a serious reply. One time a vendor saw from me: thumbs-up email, thumbs-up email, serious email dinging them for messing something up. The first two were accidents and could not be stopped or recalled.
I asked our IT team and apparently there is no MS setting to prevent these email reactions from going external. Which is insane because the internal/external email boundary is so fundamental to the MS365 value prop and security model.
Avamander
Don't worry, it's also probably going to come to other MUAs: https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9078.html
wiether
If it become standardized, it would be less annoying: you wouldn't receive shallow emails telling you that someone added an reaction to your email.
You would receive _something_ that your client could manage or drop.
Avamander
Oh yes, absolutely. I just suspect that the author of the blogpost wouldn't want even standardised reactions.
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dtgriscom
I'd like the same option with texting. It's a pain to fish my phone out of my pocket just to see a "thumbs up" emoji.
(First world problems...)
quietbritishjim
If they didn't have thumbs up as an option, they'd almost certainly feel compelled to send an actual text to show agreement. Then you have to debate whether you need to send a text back to acknowledge their agreement. Thumbs up emojis are great! They mean: I'm happy for this conversation to finish now.
whatevaa
Thumbs up emoji can be considered as legal agreement (if you had previous agreements made same way), so it is no different than any other acknowledgment.
See case of farmer having to pay penalty for not delivering on agreement, agreed over a messaging platform with a thumbs up emoji.
idiotsecant
Why? It's like an ACK.
bravetraveler
UDP vs TCP, might not care to know it was received. It may be evident/insignificant... later.
whatevaa
How it is different than if somebody responded "ok" or "sure" or any other similar message? Or is it also unwanted? How is the other side supposed to know that?
ifh-hn
Could this not be solved by setting up a file that responds to the alt-text email with something like: reaction not received, send a real email cheers.
clort
No, that does not solve the issue. You still receive 'reaction' emails but in addition, the user you emailed in the first place gets an irritating email and they suppose that you are a dick. They are in some way correct, since they likely did not know they had sent an irritating email but you do.
The truth is, this is just another embrace-extend-extinguish strategy by Microsoft. Their business ethos is, and has been for decades, to make it irritating to use software not written, and controlled, by themselves.
amiga386
> the user you emailed in the first place gets an irritating email and they suppose that you are a dick
Funny you should say that. I think that people who cause me to recieve an irritating email with nothing more than "like [person] reacted to your message" are dicks. They are sending me an email phrased like there's some third-party intermediary keeping me at arms length e.g. "Mr Blenkinsop wishes it be known that he is aware of your recent correspondance and is approving of its tone."
If you can't fix the real problem - Microsoft and their gamification of email - you can correct the views of people who think that "liking" an email is OK, which to be clear it is not. Email is not a chat client. Use words to communicate to people, and if you don't think a "reaction" merits words, then don't send one.
You need a similarly hostile user education to stop thoughtless people wasting your time in chat clients -- the moment they say "hello", and then nothing else, send them a link to https://nohello.net/ to let them know they have just been rude and inconsiderate.
Microsoft has prior history for inventing Microsoft-only shit that fucks up other mail ecosystems: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transport_Neutral_Encapsulatio...
dpark
> Email is not a chat client. Use words to communicate to people, and if you don't think a "reaction" merits words, then don't send one.
shakes fist at clouds
Seriously, though, this argument seems kind of silly. Do you not usually use words to chat? It’s fine that you don’t like this in your email but your reasoning is specious. “Chat is for emojis. Email is for words.”
ifh-hn
Haha, nearly all the people willing to email me likely know I'm a dick.
EagnaIonat
Then I could look forward to the 14 response email thread containing just a thumbs up.
rwmj
I got a hilarious email from an MS Exchange sender the other day which was attempting to "Recall" an email that the sender had just sent. Yeah, nope, that's not how Mutt + fetchmail works.
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hoistbypetard
I used to work with people who would reply, editing the subject line to end with something like " ACK. <eom>"
These "reaction" message seem about the same as that, and are no more or less annoying. If it became disruptive, I'd rather ask people to stop than fiddle with my server configuration to try to make it stop.
rs186
These custom email headers give me the vibe of vendor-prefixed CSS extensions like -moz- or -webkit-, except much worse.
kstrauser
Alternatively, report those emails as spam. Teach that great Bayes in the cloud that they’re unwanted.
dan_linder
Upvoted because that’s about the only way to get the message away.
But having said that, please don’t do that (use the “report spam” as a method to stop one specific action).
I was the technical lead for a small hobbyist group for an American sports car which was 100% mailing-list since it started in 1994. I joined the mailing list in 1996, and was asked to help (and finally take over) as the technical lead around 2004.
We had spam traffic pretty well handled with multiple opt-in confirmations: at sign-up, and yearly on the sign-in date. And every email had the proper headers for mailing lists, each subject line was prepended with “[TheNameOfTheList]”, as well as a human readable block of text at the bottom of each email with the proper way to sign out.
With all that going on, we were really solid until about 2015 or so.
Somewhere between there and the early 2020’s we started getting silently blackholed more and more by the largest email handlers (at the time, AT&T, Yahoo, and GMail). Long time subscribers would email me directly and I’d scour the mailing list system for a hint of what happened.
Finally through a friend of a friend we got hooked up with another person inside one of those mail handlers. They couldn’t confirm our mailing list specifically, but they said that even a single “mark as spam” report by any of their email users would blackhole the entire email for ALL of their users. No notification to us, no notification to the other users, just emails went missing.
By the time we determined what was going on, and having nobody at those companies to work with, we had dropped from a high of well over 4K users to below 300. We tried switching over to a Google Groups backed mailing list (around 2022), but by then the damage had been done and the few that still remained were not all that interested in being participants. I don’t think the GGroups list has had a message (aside from the “Hey, is this list still on?” test emails) in years.
So, please refrain from using the “mark as spam” for anything but pure SPAM emails.
kstrauser
I self-hosted email long enough to have done that song and dance too many times. It sucks.
And in this case, it makes me want to lean harder into it. If suddenly Outlook users, especially ones using enterprise hosted Exchange, suddenly can’t email people, then maybe this crap might get fixed. No one cares when hyper aggressive spam policies hurt you and me. They might care when it affects enterprises.
bakql
This seems like a convoluted way of adding a new header, at least compared to the http servers I know. Why is that? Maybe postfix is not the appropriate place to make this change and that’s why there’s no option to just add a new header?
infogulch
Is it really that annoying?
johannes1234321
My employer uses Outlook/Exchange and those reactions are a lot less annoying than short mails expressing the same thing on mailing lists and also is an alternative to notes not really demanding a proper response ending in the void. (Like a fun/life sharing post)
hk1337
I don’t see any issues with it using outlook either but from what it sounds like when people do it for emails not managed by outlook, they’re getting a whole new email about it? If so, I could see how that would be annoying.
tiberious726
Yes
reaperducer
Is it really that annoying?
It depends on the context.
If it's my mother acknowledging receipt of a recipe, then it's fine.
If it's a co-worker acknowledging receipt of a legal document, then it is both unprofessional, and annoying.
I mock my co-workers by replying with an actual e-mail message with the word "Thumb!" in it. They've stopped thumbing my e-mail messages.
maccard
> if it's a co-worker acknowledging receipt of a legal document, then it is both unprofessional, and annoying.
Disagree - a reaction is a perfect acknowledgement and a clear sign of “you don’t need to do anything here”. If they send an actual email it could be:
Acknowledged, thanks.
By the way can you change X to Y?
And it’s super easy to miss.idiotsecant
You're that guy who everyone thinks is weird for doing the thing. In the real world language changes over time. We need not be dogmatic about it, you know what it means.
ziml77
"Annoying" is probably a more accurate word to describe what they're thinking. Coworkers have to remember to not use the reaction buttons with this one specific person who responds like an ass to them.
reaperducer
In the real world language changes over time.
This is what we used to say back in high school.
When you have actual "real world" experience, you learn that while language changes, there is professional language that you use in the workplace, and there is informal language that you use in a bar.
You don't use a single vocabulary for every interaction in every situation of your life. You alter your speech for the situation. You don't talk to the cop that just pulled you over, or the bank manager you're trying to get money from, or your mom the same way you talk to your friends watching a sportsball game.
reaperducer
You're that guy who everyone thinks is weird for doing the thing.
You mean like articulating complete sentences?
This feels like something that should be opt-in, not opt-out. It feels trivial to have all clients that support it send a header stating they do, and it is ridiculous that the default is to allow sending reacts to clients that don't support them