SV AI Startups Are Embracing China's Controversial '996' Work Schedule
64 comments
·July 23, 2025kccqzy
The Chinese 996 work schedule is indeed hard work but it doesn't mean working 72 hours according to how westerners calculate working hours. For one, tech workers arrive at the office at 9am, not that they start working at 9am: once they arrive they simply head to the office cafeteria to have breakfast between 9am and 10am. And it's really common to spend one hour each for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Unlike westerners who'd be happy eating some cold sandwiches for lunch, the Chinese are rather picky about their food being hot and served with soup. Second, the Chinese have a weird culture of napping at the office after lunch. Not just some nap pods here and there, but institutionalized naps with day beds for all. So right off the bat, you deduct up to four hours of non-working time from twelve hours of in-office time. Finally, the Chinese also have a culture of not leaving before their bosses leave the office. This means even if a worker has finished all assigned tasks, the worker simply kills time and waits for their boss to leave. It might be reading internal documentation, or it might be something less productive.
996 refers to time in office, not time worked. The actual hours worked is closer to 48 hours per week than 72 hours.
rs186
Very true, but that's 12 hours spent at your workspace. Having dinner at home is different from at your job, that's obvious, right? I bet that most people would rather have 30 minute meals and go home one hour early, with everything else the same, because that's one extra hour spent however the way they want.
threatofrain
IMO that really is still the same thing as working because you can't spend that time with your family. The fact that it's nice doesn't change that you're working, spending time away from those you love.
kevinventullo
The distinction between hours in the office and hours working is interesting to an employer. It is not interesting to the employee. The fact of the matter is that 996, assuming a 30 minute commute, means people are spending 2/3 of their lives working for someone else. And then when the exit comes, the founders and the investors can screw you in a heartbeat and still get theirs (see Windsurf).
OutOfHere
It's actually not weird to nap after lunch. It's weird not to (when considering a global perspective).
Since there are no nap pods in the West, the closest I found myself doing is relaxation exercises in a phone booth for 30 minutes, and this significantly boosted my afternoon productivity.
mrangle
Great. Does 996 require the schedule that it implies? If so, respectfully, those excuses are moot.
fellowniusmonk
Everything we know about systems resilience shows that 60% to 80% utilization is the sweet spot. We treat our silicon topology better than our human topology.
ckelly
This article is arguing for working hours that equate to about 65% of waking hours. So your range seems too high.
legostormtroopr
I think from context a more likely interpretation of the parent comment is that it is saying "60% to 80% utilisation [of working hours]".
ckelly
Perhaps. But what defines working hours?
neilv
I have worked hours like that, for years. Over time, i learned that it's mainly good if you don't know what you're doing, and you want to waste lots of time, and not be at your sharpest. While also often feeling like crap.
The next time I'm leading a team, I'm leaning towards 40 solid hours/wk being the official way to go.
Up to around 60 hours/wk of mixed-solidity work is also sustainable long-term for most people, without ill health effects iff some of that will be much lower-productivity time and the people don't have daily family obligations and the overall stress isn't too high.
But if some people wanted to try 50-60 hours and a mix of pace themselves, I'd probably have them structure it so that they appeared to 40-hour colleagues as if they were also doing 40 hours. Which means no slacking off in front of them, nobody getting disturbed on off hours with messages or pull request reviews, etc.
happytoexplain
>The next time I'm leading a team, I'm leaning towards 40 solid hours/wk being the official way to go.
We are sick as a civilization and a species.
tennisflyi
There will be no liberation with AI. Hasn’t been with any other tech. Output always fills the space/time created
nextworddev
Depends on whether your company / business is on the winning or losing side of the shift
pitched
Productivity goes up while wages stay the same. Whatever side the business is on, an hour still costs the same, whether it’s more productive or not.
boredatoms
How are they going to recruit for that without paying megabucks
preommr
By leveraging an oversaturated labor market.
This will upset people, but I love programming enough that I would do 996 at 40k-50k usd, with half going to rent and potentially even paying out of pocket for medical insurance.
karmakurtisaani
But would you be OK with the fact that your boss is making millions off your passion?
As an ex-academic, I know where you're coming from. In academia it's easier to justify working all thr time, since at least no one is making money. It's just for the love of pursuing knowledge. I cannot imagine breaking my back smiling just to make someone else rich.
gruez
I think OP's point isn't that he'd accept taking a job at [insert tech company here] and have them pay him $50k, when the going rate is $300k or whatever, it's that in a hypothetical scenario where programming isn't prestigious and the pay was only $50k, he'd still take that job (as opposed to finding another line of work like finance or whatever).
winrid
Why? At that salary just be a bus driver or something and code for fun.
gruez
Same reason why "starving artists" (eg. actors, musicians, and game developers) don't become bus drivers and do their art over the weekend. They like the job so much they'd rather take the pay cut and poor working conditions just to work in the job. It's a well-known concept in economics: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compensating_differential
Philpax
If you're willing to take a loss like that, you should spend your time programming for yourself, not willingly making yourself a victim of exploitation.
jennyholzer
Why wouldn't you do freelance or speculative work if you're putting that many hours in?
horns4lyfe
That’s so dumb, you don’t have to do that to spend all your time programming. Honestly
bpodgursky
They pay megabucks.
boredatoms
Most startups are poor though, so I cant see this becoming widespread
DavidSJ
Sometimes literally with that SI prefix.
princevegeta89
By bullshitting to employees that what they're building is the next big thing. AI has created a very bad culture and these startups have become very good at grabbing new grads or junior engineers that have a lot of energy and time and by saying they're going to be doing amazing things by working these 996 schedules...
The reality is the vast majority of these companies will be hit hard by a burst of the AI bubble. It won't be a surprise the so called millions they're looking for end up being a 0.
AaronAPU
Does anyone else feel more productive doing about 4 hours per day? I really have found it to be a sweet spot and since it’s so sustainable (endurance pace), I enjoy getting a couple hours in during weekend early mornings.
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ausbah
with this and the recent Windsurf “acquisition”, what’s even the draw to startups anymore? 25% base pay increase for 80% more hours (not even considering overtime) with equity that is tantamount to useless (with or without Windsurf being the new norm)? super hard pass and I hope everyone with half a brain does the same
AI is being used as an excuse to strip away every labor norm and law in the name of “not being left behind”, with a product that has yet to truly be earth shattering on the scale it’s been predicted to be. hard not to see the current slate of VCs and founders as leechs
reactordev
This is true. Everyone I have visited in SV is working from wake to sleep, at some Airbnb, where you are expected to just exist there. It’s slavery.
RainyDayTmrw
It's a race to the bottom, and it hurts all of us.
selimnairb
Brilliant, 996 yourself out of a job.
https://archive.is/J5uMp