The Effect of Noise on Sleep
85 comments
·June 27, 2025socalgal2
sjs382
> only allowed to be built on busy streets
Is this true or a misleading observation?
I can see some argument about it, increasing traffic in areas that aren't equipped for it if the building is large enough. But it might just be market forces, too: in larger cities, it's often more desirable to be near a major artery. Earplugs (if the noise bothers you) vs a longer commute.
aegypti
It is quite literally illegal to build anything but detached single family homes on 95.8 percent of the total residential land area in California / 75% of the residential land area in most major American cities.
aegypti
https://cayimby.org/legislation/sb-79/
They will be allowed by right near any type of transit stop if SB79 goes through!
amanaplanacanal
Streets are much quieter at lower speed limits. There is definitely room for improvement here from the traffic engineers.
gowld
Downtown is very low speed but very noisy.
gowld
That's not a problem with the location. That's a problem with building materials. I've lives on the busiest street in town, with well insulated walls and windows that block out street noise. And I've lived in poorly -constructed suburban houses that admit noise from across the neighborhood.
Anechoic
FYI, there's been tons of research of the effects of noise on sleep from different sources. There have been studies ranging from in-lab experiments, to in-home experiments with artificial and natural sources. If you're interested, some resources:
Institute of Noise Control Engineering Digital library: https://www.inceusa.org/publications/ince-digital-library/ (papers older than 10 years old are available free)
Federal Interagency Committee on Aviation Noise: https://fican1.wordpress.com/findings/ (focuses on aviation noise)
Acoustical Society of America Lay Language Papers: https://acoustics.org/lay-language-papers/ (search for "sleep" -- the ASA has a full library of more detailed research but the documents cost money unless you're an ASA member)
World Health Organization guidelines on noise - https://iris.who.int/bitstream/handle/10665/343936/WHO-EURO-... (doesn't get into specifics on research on sleep, but does refer recommended limits to sleep disturbance)
NIH has done a bunch of research on sleep disturbance from noise, you would need to search through their library
edit (one more): TRB/National Academies https://nap.nationalacademies.org/search/?rpp=20&ft=1&term=n...
A lot of the stuff that posters are asking for have in fact been done, it just takes some digging through the research sites to find them. There's a lot of variation in the data, the hypothesis is that sleep sensitivity varies a lot based on various physical factors (age being a big one).
ChuckMcM
Interesting, perhaps age related deafness contributes.
bumby
A couple things:
1) I’d like to see additional measures beyond dB. A 50dB consistent white noise does not bother me (and may even enhance my sleep) but an intermittent off/on sound of the same magnitude has a very different effect
2) what is the accuracy of the consumer metrics compared to medical benchmarks? In other words, how reliable are the sleep measures of consumer devices? Anecdotally, I’ve noticed my watch thinks I’m sleeping sometimes when I watch a movie, and I’ve heard MDs say the metrics aren’t accurate enough to make strong conclusions.
brandonb
#1 is a great idea for follow-up -- looking at variance, 90th percentile vs median, and so on. There's probably some very salient measure of sleep-affecting noise that we can derive from the data.
On the accuracy of sleep metrics, when Apple Watch makes an error, it tends to misclassify deep or REM sleep as core (light) sleep, or waking as light sleep. It's relatively rare to misclassify deep or REM sleep as awake, or deep as REM (and vice versa). That's partly why we focus on those specific sleep metrics. You can see a full confusion matrix here: https://www.empirical.health/metrics/deep-sleep-percent#accu...
bumby
Thanks! That’s great information. Do you have any data on how that performance compares to medical-grade devices?
brandonb
The confusion matrix linked above compares the Apple Watch to polysomnography equipment (which is the medical device used in a sleep lab). It doesn't _quite_ answer your question, since we're assuming the polysomnography equipment is ground truth, but it at least gives an idea of the discordance between a consumer device and a medical device.
garyfirestorm
There is a field dedicated to this called as psychoacoustics. Sound pressure level (SPL) alone won’t work for this experiment like you said. There are other metrics like steady state and transient noise, masking from different frequencies having different effects on humans. It is definitely doable but far more complicated than the tweets seem to make it sound.
thesuitonym
It would also be interesting to see the effects of intermittent noise when there is ambient background noise.
wkat4242
Yes i always sleep with a nature sound generator. It's comforting.
willsmith72
yes, that would be nice to have. but surely the data we have already would suggest for the benefit of our entire society, especially children (with the link between good sleep and mental development), we should incentivise thicker windows, better sills and other quick wins now
bumby
To the point above, we should be careful about making strong conclusions if there is a lot of uncertainty in the underlying data.
willsmith72
On the contrary, we gain more by making faster decisions than we do by being 100% precise
mmh0000
I’ve spent years “fixing” my sleep. Things I recommend:
* a sleep tracker. I love AutoSleep - https://apps.apple.com/us/app/autosleep-track-sleep-on-watch...
* Any kind of white noise. I use an air purifier at home, and a little pocket size white noise machine when I travel.
* find and eliminate any noises in your home. Computers, fridges, squeaky doors, etc.
* find and eliminate any lights. Especially stupid power and status LEDs. Bedroom should be pitch black at night. Electrical tape works well for this.
* Blackout curtains
* cheap eye mask
* Magnesium Glycate supplement
* Earplugs- https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0015TBGR6
* And finally, a recent addition that I’ve fallen in love with is sleep ear buds: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DT9GBFQ2
Although, I would wait on getting sleep ear buds, Anker just announced a new model with ANC and a similar price.
conradev
A lot of folks are talking about the “consistency” of a sound (constant white noise vs random sounds) and its volume, but I feel like the nature of the sound matters a lot more.
I’ll respond much differently to my bedroom door opening or a voice speaking than I do a bus outside.
It reminds me of the anecdote where human researchers rang bells near bears (human sounds) and the bears didn’t care, but if they broke a large bundle of branches (bear sounds), the bears went berserk.
I feel like our subconscious is a lot more involved here than we give it credit for.
mmahemoff
This is especially true for sleep since we can be pretty good at incorporating external sounds into our dreams. It's been shown in controlled experiments. Seems likely that certain noises are generically easier to integrate into dreams than other noises, which could just cause you to wake up or have your sleep otherwise impaired.
alexyaseen
why don't more hotels seem to understand this? so often I find that even nice hotels have very minimal background noise but poor soundproofing of the doors. so hallway noise disrupts sleep so much
gowld
Because good materials cost more than "fancy" decorations.
null
YossarianFrPrez
Some days I joke that there should be a set of Nobel prizes for making machines quieter. Categories could include: air-conditioning units and mini-fridges, construction and landscaping equipment, old university buildings, pump-housings, etc. The quality of life of many would be improved if we had quieter machines. It boggles my mind that a) in many hotel rooms one can hear a good deal of machine noise and neighbors' televisions, and b) that some sort of noise score (as calculated from DB meter measurements) isn't more widely available for things like apartment rentals, conference room bookings, etc.
sidewndr46
Noise from construction machines is actually a feature. They all have added backup beepers at this point as required per OSHA guidelines. Audible for well over a mile in normal conditions
arp242
> Audible for well over a mile in normal conditions
That doesn't strike me as a feature.
Also a solved problem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rwJ5NCf1Vw
Tesco delivery trucks have them here in Ireland; it's pretty good stuff. Still quite loud/noticeable when you're up close, while at the same time not being completely obnoxious to everyone in a kilometre radius.
sidewndr46
They have to be loud enough to be heard through hearing protection. The amplitude is a feature.
It's a "solved problem" in the sense that nuclear energy is a solved problem. There's no mandate to actually see widespread roll out of anything that may be a better solution.
There's a construction site near me at present. There is always 1 machine in reverse, at all times. The utility of having a backup beeper or any noise making device on that site is thus zero. It is the single largest source of noise pollution, larger than the roadway
gowld
Those beepers should be directional. I don't need to hear the beep opposite the direction of movement.
willsmith72
what about a noise tax? my city has some electric buses and some ancient buses - the difference obviously is absolutely huge, but right now the financial incentives aren't there to upgrade the whole fleet
stronglikedan
> making machines quieter
It's already possible, just not profitable.
lm2s
Would love to know what kind of noise and sound level was used for this test. Was it a continuous monotonous noise (such as white/pink/brown noise) at a fixed volume? Or was it some random noise that would "pop-up" randomly?
Does anyone know?
I would imagine that a noise that would randomly "pop-up" would be worse. But would be curious if that's not the case.
cheeseomlit
That's also what I was wondering- I sleep with a fan on for the white noise, otherwise I sleep very poorly if at all. I wonder if that sort of 'covers up' the spikes in noise you'd be hearing if the room were otherwise silent
brandonb
This was ambient noise in the room, as measured by an Apple Watch. So “random,” real world noises that pop up, as opposed to a controlled level of white noise.
maerF0x0
+1 also thought about this.
Something like the variability of noise (eg, maybe figure out the 25th percentile dbs across the night, and then count the spikes above that? or maybe count the number of times the slope goes above a certain value indicating sharp rises in volume that would disturb someone?)
I also would love to simply see the data based on the average of "N loudest moment(s)" during the sleep. eg: treat the dbs score for that night as the average of the N loudest moments over the night, and plot a series of graphs that show various values of N. (or make it 3d, but i've found many folks are not capable of reading those kinds of graphs)
uludag
I've been using earplugs practically every night for the past three years and I can't recommend them enough. While the particular kind I use (Mack's ultra soft) don't block out all the noise, there is a wide variety of noises that used to wake me up which don't anymore. If you haven't tried them I would highly recommend giving sleeping with earplugs a shot. It only takes a few days or so to get used to them.
In terms of downsides, only once in the past three years did I get some earwax clogged in some part of my ear which was easy to remove with some special spray (went to urgent care). Also, I have a very hard time sleeping without them anymore so I always make sure to have a pair at hand. Also, you may have to experiment with various brands and types as some brands are really uncomfortable and hurt my ear.
octo888
3M 1100 are great. You can get a box of 200 pairs
Unfortunately they changed a bit the past few years to be slightly less comfortable but I still find them the best overall
Arainach
Foam are significantly less comfortable for side sleeping and block less noise than Silicone (Mack's) which still come in large sets for well under $1/pair.
roamerz
That’s all great until something happens while you are sleeping that needs your attention. I’d love to be able to use something like that but being responsible for my family’s safety says I cannot.
Maybe there is room for a device that recognizes those types of sounds and maybe triggers a watch vibration would be a solution.
uludag
That's a valid point. Alarms of all sorts do still wake me up, along with crying babies. It worked well when my wife and I were taking shifts being with the baby. When it was my turn to rest, using earplugs definitely made my sleep time more effective.
codyb
I can't tell you what sirens outside do to my sleep, but I can tell you they can be very agitating when I'm trying to fall asleep.
It's funny though how during the recent heat dome I could barely sleep after sealing the windows cause of just how dang quiet it was!
Fickle mistress sleep be.
emsign
I'm using pink noise to suppress my REM phase and get more deep sleep when my body needs extra regeneration at the expense of mental regeneration. Luckily there's none of that random street noise in my neighborhood.
mmahemoff
I wish someone could solve the problem at the receiver end, i.e., invent noise-cancelling headphones/earplugs that actually cancel noise as effectively as eye-masks cancel light.
In addition to sleep needs, the world has gotten noisier now that people are habitually using speakerphones in public in the most obnoxious ways.
hn_throw2025
I used to use mouldable silicone ear plugs :
https://bioears.co.uk/products/bioears-ear-plugs
Very effective, but eventually they made me just focus on my tinnitus.
I now live in a quieter place and use some white noise from a speaker - ocean sounds.
jks
These are the most comfortable earplugs I've used:
https://www.elacin.com/your-perfect-fit/leisure/relax-sleep/
Currently I use Ozlo Sleepbuds which are not quite as comfortable and a little finicky to operate, but I like the masking noise.
dmoy
I mean....
https://westone.com/defendear-sleep
Gets you some pretty good quiet for sleep. It's not active noise cancelling, but they work pretty well.
Anecdotally if you wear a pair of westone solids, and then a pair of earmuffs on top of that, you are basically just hearing through your bones, which can't be avoided (with passive or active).
jabo
Wonder if white noise counts as noise from this perspective. Or if it’s mainly unexpected noises that make sleep quality worse.
rybosworld
In many animals, hearing gets less sensitive in general when they sleep. I think it's common for people to be surprised by that, but it works that way to maximize sleep function.
Dog's are thought to be an exception, because part of their domestication involved selection for the offspring that was more alert (watch dogs).
The brain is thought to be hyper sensitive to a certain subset of sounds while sleeping, such as babies crying.
White noise is thought to work by drowning out the sounds we are most sensitive to.
I don't know how to state this well but I find the fact that nearly all new apartment buildings in California are only allowed to be built on busy streets very frustrating. I'm guessing it's part nimby-ism and part zoning but every time I see a new apartment complex it's next to the busiest streets in the city (LA, SF). It's like many things, if you want health you must be rich. If you can't afford a house then F.U. You get a loud apartment with constant traffic noise.
I *almost* feel like it should be illegal to build them next to the freeway like
Those ones just north of SFO next to the 110: https://maps.app.goo.gl/sAkUMhmnutZ1jFd27
The ones in downtown LA next to the 110: https://maps.app.goo.gl/4mBVLo12hLR4EwU16
The ones north of LAX at Howard Hughes: https://maps.app.goo.gl/Z8bnB7wR5jDBddhg6
I don't actually think I think they should be illegal but dang it, I wish there were more options for new apartments. In LA there are lots of older apartment buildings in quiet residential neighborhoods built 50+ years ago.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/KMLav1zLiQZK6T8L6
https://maps.app.goo.gl/aUH52rBAbaHExjzB6
They are no longer allowed to be built AFAICT.